DB02 cheaper alternative to TRF502 announced tamiya 58507

[qatmix]

Tamiya release schedule:
58507- RCC Middle Class Shaft Buggy DB02.

Might help get some cheap spares, also looks like they are moving away from belt off road buggies :(

[Origineelreclamebord]

Tamiya release schedule:
58507- RCC Middle Class Shaft Buggy DB02.

Might help get some cheap spares, also looks like they are moving away from belt off road buggies :(

I had exactly the same thought when I saw this: The excitement about the fact that Tamiya will release a new buggy, but the disappointment that this is probably the end of the line for Tamiya's belt driven buggies.

[DavidAMS]

any pics?:thumbsup:

[DCM]

link and pics please

[qatmix]

no pics yet, the info is from a shop stock release list (along with a load of tt01's and a VW camper van on a lunchbox chassis)

[DCM]

mmmm, my original DB-01 needs retiring..... I am guessing the same things will go on it, shocks, cvd's etc... I could well be tempted!!

[a.m]

hhhmm, mayby not using my 511, maby it will get a colectors item in 30 years...

[5ohTwoX]

I hope it comes with gear diffs instead of ball diffs. I'm tired of rebuilding the diffs in my 502X.

[rcaddict]

I talked to someone at Tamiya America and he said there were no plans to discontinue DB01. :p

[cjm_2008]

Tamiya release schedule:
58507- RCC Middle Class Shaft Buggy DB02.


does it come with a free copy of the guardian, and waitrose vouchers?

[dobber]

does it come with a free copy of the guardian, and waitrose vouchers?
:thumbsup:

Ive got a 502X and oddly enough mine came with a M&S bag dont you know ;)

[Origineelreclamebord]

http://tamiyablog.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/tamiya-58507.jpg
http://tamiyablog.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/tamiya-58507-db02.jpg

There you go! :) Seems like this car will have a centre diff? I hope it will be one that can be filled with oil then! I see a slipper clutch in the design as well, so there are hopes Tamiya will finally release a club racer/high end basher with a slipper clutch!? :o:thumbsup:

I do think they need to re-consider that body - hideous! The wing seems to be the TRF501X/DF03 MS one.

[sosidge]

From Tamiyablog...

http://tamiyablog.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/tamiya-58507.jpg

Very wide shell. Why?

http://tamiyablog.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/tamiya-58507-db02.jpg

Because it seems to be concealing a transverse motor with a complicated central gearbox. Superficially it looks like a centre diff, but I think it is actually a dual-gear drive, one for the front gearbox, the other for the rear.

Interesting solution, rather like one of the possible ways of building the Awesomatix touring car, and evocative of the classic Tamiya 4wd chassis. Puts the motor in the ideal orientation for getting the power down, but also hangs it out off the side of the chassis.[/URL]

[cjm_2008]

Superficially it looks like a centre diff, but I think it is actually a dual-gear drive, one for the front gearbox, the other for the rear.

Interesting solution, rather like one of the possible ways of building the Awesomatix touring car, and evocative of the classic Tamiya 4wd chassis. Puts the motor in the ideal orientation for getting the power down, but also hangs it out off the side of the chassis.[/URL]

it looks as if it will have two counter-rotating propshafts. I wonder if tamiya have done some computational modelling on this design - looks quite a complex thing to try at random.

[sosidge]

it looks as if it will have two counter-rotating propshafts. I wonder if tamiya have done some computational modelling on this design - looks quite a complex thing to try at random.

I thought that at first, but if you look a the relative position of the bearings for the output shafts, they are offset, so the two pairs of gears are not meshing together.

[craigosh]

Appears to have enough space to take a third saddle pack under the rear drive shaft
What would make this really awesome is if they had designed the body shell to emulate the manta ray!! :D

[Origineelreclamebord]

Appears to have enough space to take a third saddle pack under the rear drive shaft
What would make this really awesome is if they had designed the body shell to emulate the manta ray!! :D

They seem like the small LiFe batteries they're trying to use in all of their new releases - or it's a stick pack with two braces over the top of it, making it look like 3 batteries :p I just hope they make it compatible with regular size batteries as well or this chassis won't sell.

Anyway, I hadn't spotted the offset on the gears yet. I don't see though why they didn't use a single shaft and two gears less instead then if it's not a diff, this just results in more mass, and in the exact spot where you don't want it: Your drivetrain. It also doesn't seem to result in any advantages for moving the motor more to the center.

[Chris]

The best things from the 502X and the 511 combined in one car.

The position of the electronics and the steering geometry from the 511. The gearboxes from the 502X.

Slipper is not included but optional:
54336 DB02 Slipper Clutch set

[cjm_2008]

I thought that at first, but if you look a the relative position of the bearings for the output shafts, they are offset, so the two pairs of gears are not meshing together.

ah yes - you're bob on. the offset is maybe 3mm & there's a solid layshaft to the opposing pinion. wouldn't it be cool if tamiya took this opportunity to introduce some sort of torque splitting device on the layshaft?

[DaveG28]

I love it, Tamiya madness! So does that mean the rear propshaft is high up in order to clear the battery? Can't quite make it out?

Like someone mentioned, question then will be if Lipo's will fit, either a saddle either side or a stick underneath?

[budgio]

What will Tamiya will call this one?
Another crazy name no doubt :) ... i like the look of it.

[Miguel_AM]

http://img717.imageshack.us/img717/1962/tamiya58507.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/717/tamiya58507.jpg/)

http://img521.imageshack.us/img521/7182/tamiya58507db02.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/521/tamiya58507db02.jpg/)

[bzb]

What will Tamiya will call this one?
Another crazy name no doubt :) ... i like the look of it.

i opt for:

"wild snotpork" :)

[sim]

The battery pack looks like a normal brick pack. No idea what is going on with that drivetrain but it's new and I like it. :thumbsup:

[t8rtot]

ANOTHER HOMERUN FROM THE JAP GIANT

[Carno]

Buddha. Cause it's phat.

[DaveG28]

I still don't get how a lipo fits!? How do they get the rear centre shaft high enough? Where on those picture would you fit lipo connectors??

Don't get me wrong though, if there's no sign of a new TRF by the time this is available I'm sure I'll get one for a play, IF lipos fit!?

When is it due again?

[mof]

I still don't get how a lipo fits!? How do they get the rear centre shaft high enough? Where on those picture would you fit lipo connectors??

Don't get me wrong though, if there's no sign of a new TRF by the time this is available I'm sure I'll get one for a play, IF lipos fit!?

When is it due again?

Looking at the pics I would say that quite simply rear centre shaft is high enough to allow the lipo to sit under it.

And I would assume that the lipo connectors on either end of the stick pack would be visible, it would be insane for Tamiya to make a car that does not find a standard Lipo...

[qatmix]

I have a video on my blog here http://thercracer.blogspot.com/2011/11/tamiya-fair-video.html
Lots of video of the DB02 from 30 mins in

[DaveG28]

I have to have one, it looks so mad!! Probably thin lipo's will go in, but that body looks mad, never mind cab forward, it's cab everywhere!!!

When is it due, no chance by Christmas I assume?

[James]

It looks huge doesn't it!

[knighthawk]

I have a video on my blog here http://thercracer.blogspot.com/2011/11/tamiya-fair-video.html
Lots of video of the DB02 from 30 mins in


Cool vid,
like to see how the third diff will work when its on the track
strange way, layout and strange concept

great

[mof]

Cool vid,
like to see how the third diff will work when its on the track
strange way, layout and strange concept

great

There is no third diff.

[Jamesk]

I will look at replacing my DB01-R if there is a DB02-R verson. I like the fact the car is a bit differant from the norm, well done Tamiya for this concept, but can we have a better looking bodyshell please or employ a new body design guy !!!!

jK

[Carno]

They actually did employ new design guys for this. The body was designed by the actual TOM'S racing team.

Dudes that make cars like this.
http://img.2dehands.be/f/normal/105420478-autoart-1-18-lexus-sc-430-tom-s-racing.jpg

[Chris]

I will look at replacing my DB01-R if there is a DB02-R verson. I like the fact the car is a bit differant from the norm, well done Tamiya for this concept, but can we have a better looking bodyshell please or employ a new body design guy !!!!

jK

source: http://kentech.blogs.se/
"A nice detail is that the body was designed by the TOM'S racing team in Japan!"

[sosidge]

I have a video on my blog here http://thercracer.blogspot.com/2011/11/tamiya-fair-video.html
Lots of video of the DB02 from 30 mins in

Good find qatmix!

DB02 looks typically bonkers/inspired, love Willy's Bus, and the Celica LB Turbo deserves to be put on a track, that's a proper race car.

[DCM]

Well, I know what 4wd car I will be running next year... woot!!

[kentech]

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c99/kentech/db02b2.jpg

I quite like it :)

Here's more on TOM's:
http://www.tomsracing.co.jp/motorsports/index.html

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c99/kentech/db02i2.jpg

[Jamie.T]

Absolutely love it, but i do wonder why they didnt mesh all 4 gears together in the centre gearbox for better durability. I know the front and rear centre shafts would spin in opposite direction, but that's easily reversed by turning the diff around, plus it would cancel out the torque effect from left to right.

But i do love the idea of that centre gearbox tho, also looks like its sealed for putting different weight oil in there, great for tunability.

[HeavyD99]

I thought my Baldre body looked wide next to a 511 - this DB02 will look twice that!

Interesting design none the less - would like to see how it handles and know more about that centre "diff".

Right now though, I'm going to upgrade my DB01R with gear diffs, it has everything else on it - and I still like my belts.:thumbsup:

....and did anyone else notice that the Super Shot is looking to be re-released in 2012?!! Talk about gotta have!

[colmo]

What will Tamiya will call this one?
Another crazy name no doubt :) ... i like the look of it.

Leonis?

http://thercracer.blogspot.com/2011/11/tamiya-58507-db02-pics.html

Had an involuntary vision of a barely clad, muscular man kicking someone into a pit and shouting "This is Tamiya!"

[mof]

Absolutely love it, but i do wonder why they didnt mesh all 4 gears together in the centre gearbox for better durability. I know the front and rear centre shafts would spin in opposite direction, but that's easily reversed by turning the diff around, plus it would cancel out the torque effect from left to right.


No, they wouldn't spin at all, as both sides of the driveshaft gears would try to spin in the same direction...

By the way, I love the modern electrics in the "demo car"! :drool:

[Chris]

From the pictures it looks like that the car has an angled steering system, like the steering system used at the TRF511/TRF501X platform. Maybe this is also usable on the TRF502X.

[Chris]

And the name is:.............


Leonis

[Jamie.T]

No, they wouldn't spin at all, as both sides of the driveshaft gears would try to spin in the same direction...

Yes the would, a differential spins with 2 sun gears and 2 planet gears, all 4 of which are joined and rotate fine, but the output shafts would spin in opposite direction, think about it.......

Here's an example that might show how they would work better.
http://www.ebneter-ag.ch/Technik/Visco_mit_Diff.jpg

[mof]

Yes the would, a differential spins with 2 sun gears and 2 planet gears, all 4 of which are joined and rotate fine, but the output shafts would spin in opposite direction, think about it.......

Here's an example that might show how they would work better.
http://www.ebneter-ag.ch/Technik/Visco_mit_Diff.jpg

But it (DB02 center... thing) is not a differential, hence I think that the two gears that are not directly connected to the driveshaft are "statically" connected to the shaft rotating them, and they both rotate in the same direction. With gear diff they are not connected to the shaft between them and rotate freely in either direction (opposite of each other).

[Jamie.T]

Ah right, i see what you mean in that the 2 (in effect) sun gears are part of the shaft, but this could easily be changed so that the gear opposite spur gear side can rotate freely on the shaft as opposed to connected.

I love the look of the car, but with high powered brushless gear i can see the small contact point of the centre gears stripping quite easily.

[DaveG28]

Ah right, i see what you mean in that the 2 (in effect) sun gears are part of the shaft, but this could easily be changed so that the gear opposite spur gear side can rotate freely on the shaft as opposed to connected.

I love the look of the car, but with high powered brushless gear i can see the small contact point of the centre gears stripping quite easily.

Are they metal gears, loos like it, so they may hold up??

Be well noisy though!!

[sim]

Ah right, i see what you mean in that the 2 (in effect) sun gears are part of the shaft, but this could easily be changed so that the gear opposite spur gear side can rotate freely on the shaft as opposed to connected.


If either of those gear can spin freely on the shaft, the car would be a 2WD.

The only thing we can be certain about that box is that it is out-of-the-box. I think they should have named it the Manolis.

[Jamie.T]

If either of those gear can spin freely on the shaft, the car would be a 2WD.

As it is yes, but if you read my earlier post i said "if all 4 gears meshed together" as a durability suggestion. If all 4 were to make contact, and the 1 gear (away from spur) on the short shaft were too move freely it would be a lot stronger and the 2 opposing centre shafts would spin and counter rotate the balance of the car.

[sim]

Ah, gotcha.

I think I was thinking too hard about what that box could be. As soon as I stopped thinking, I figured it out. Duh! They just wanted to mount the motor sideways and still run shafts. It's just a compact transmission design so that everything fits.

It's going to lean to one side in the air, I think.

Still, I like it.

[muratti]

I know Tamiya cars since the eighties and know that sometimes they have released very much complicated, overengineered cars. This for example looks very much like the old Chassis like Avante and Egress in the way that they are way too complicated while the competitors show how easy and simple a design can be. I see there are way too many gears therefore bearings and so on that could get damaged. While i think this will be in the price region of the Durango V3 it will clearly be the worse car thorughout.

Don´t get me wrong guys, i am a Tamiya lover since i was 11 but i find it really strange to release a super car like TRF511, then convert this design to shaft driven, will say TRF502X and convert this one to the budget version and make it way more complicated and more expensive to maintain in comparison to 511 and 502X. Everyone who has driven either one of these TRF´s will tell me i am right when i say the only this you need for the 511 is some center pulleys and some diff pulleys. Once in a season change the belts and you´re done.

Am i the only one who thinks Tamiya have released a car that goes backwards in evolution rather than forward?

I find the car interestin- no doubt about, but only to talk about it, i am definitly not keen on driving it...

[knighthawk]

There is no third diff.

From the Tamiya Blog pics it looked like it could have been a diff as the pic is unclear.

From the later pic you can clearly see the spur gear turns the rear gearbox the other side turns the front gearbox, as the two gears on the spur shaft dont mess with both main gears

my bad

[Fredrik Emilsson]

As it is yes, but if you read my earlier post i said "if all 4 gears meshed together" as a durability suggestion. If all 4 were to make contact, and the 1 gear (away from spur) on the short shaft were too move freely it would be a lot stronger and the 2 opposing centre shafts would spin and counter rotate the balance of the car.

But even if the second gear (away from spur) meshed with the center gears it would´nt make any difference?
Still just one gear (closest to spur gear) that transfers all power to center gear.
The second gear have to transfer power to center gear to make any difference.
Just my thought.

[Carno]

Am i the only one who thinks Tamiya have released a car that goes backwards in evolution rather than forward?

I find the car interestin- no doubt about, but only to talk about it, i am definitly not keen on driving it...

I wouldn't say backwards. More like a side step in evolution.
It could very well die at this point if it's unsuccesfull but if putting the motor sideways, so it rotates in the direction the car is driving, proves succesfull it might evolve further from there.

[Jamie.T]

But even if the second gear (away from spur) meshed with the center gears it would´nt make any difference?
Still just one gear (closest to spur gear) that transfers all power to center gear.
The second gear have to transfer power to center gear to make any difference.
Just my thought.

Yes, but the second gear away from spur would push up against the 2 centre gears to help prevent them from flexing away from the driven gear and causing it to slip. It would work sort of like a pressure gear to prevent side flex whilst power is applied.

Who knows, maybe its strong enough and with a little grease in there in should be ok. It was just a thought.

[rcaddict]

Tamiya would be smart to design this new 4WD buggy with counter rotating center shafts. This design philosophy is used in current Superbike engine designs to cancel out the gyroscopic effect of a single rotating mass (the engine crank). If this new car in fact has counter rotating shafts you would get to have your cake and eat it too. You would get the well mannered mid air behavior of a belt drive paired with the low down torquish grunt and durability of a shaft drive. I will be following this car very closely, but for now I have a brand new TRF511 with Hop Ups to build, as well as a brand new DB01R still in the box. DB02 can wait until next fall. Maybe they will release a DB02R or a TRF512 by then. :thumbsup:

[sim]

When it comes to racing, Tamiya sticks to what works, which is why TRF buggies have a pretty boring design once you've seen their older cousins from as JConcepts, Yokomo and Associated.

When it comes to their low to mid range kits, they let their engineers have some fun. This time, they wanted to try out a sideways motor, a sideways battery and shafts, so they did. This buggy should have a high moment of inertia along an axis through the length of its chassis, but a low moment of inertia perpendicular to that (i.e. when viewed sideways). From past cars, we can guess that it will handle bumps well but will be slow in sideway transitions. I'm thinking it's also going to lean to the left a lot when it jumps.

They could have done the transmission Awesomatix style to simplify things...
http://awesomatix.com/carsimages/transmission/1big.jpg
... but I think they wanted the spur and layshaft to be as solidly mounted as possible on the far side since the spur side will be taken up by a slipper clutch option later.

It's new and different which is what is significant. Will it drive better than a 502 or even a DB01? I seriously doubt it. Will it sell? Who knows? Some people will buy the car thinking a new design will solve all their driving problems. Some people will buy the car to be different from their friends at the track. Some people will buy the car to put on a shelf.

Although I agree that the overall buggy itself is not a step forward in design evolution, but this transmission might actually be ahead of its time. If motors get smaller/more powerful, I don't see why we wouldn't use this complicated contraption. I for one would put a custom build together to see it work.

Hmm...

[Fredrik Emilsson]

Yes, but the second gear away from spur would push up against the 2 centre gears to help prevent them from flexing away from the driven gear and causing it to slip. It would work sort of like a pressure gear to prevent side flex whilst power is applied.

Who knows, maybe its strong enough and with a little grease in there in should be ok. It was just a thought.

Yes, we can only guess.:)
I think the transmission will be pretty solid. The main axle is BB supported on the outside and the gearbox look pretty solid. So it should´nt be able to flex. But we will see.:)
This solution also means that the shafts rotate in same direction.

I think the Awesomatix solution would flex more.

[rcaddict]

It should'nt lean at all when it jumps, the center shafts rotate in opposite directions. :thumbsup:

[mof]

It should'nt lean at all when it jumps, the center shafts rotate in opposite directions. :thumbsup:

No, they don't.

http://i3.aijaa.com/b/00233/9103487.jpg

[rcaddict]

both your top yellow arrow, and your left blue arrow need to be flipped around. :D

[Jamie.T]

both your top yellow arrow, and your left blue arrow need to be flipped around. :D

How can you flip the top yellow around around, its fixed to the same shaft as the lower yellow arrow so MUST spin in the same direction.

That drawing is 100% correct, try looking at it again and realise that the top gear is connected to the front centre shaft only, and the bottom gear is connected to the rear centre shaft only.

Heres a diagram similar to above but showing where the gaps are and will also show which gears are the driven ones.

http://www.jtmodels.co.uk/images/db02_gearbox.png

[mof]

both your top yellow arrow, and your left blue arrow need to be flipped around. :D

They can only be flipped around if all the arrows were flipped, thus resulting in the shafts rotating in the same direction, as before.

The gear near the spur drives the rear driveshaft, and the gear opposite to the spur side drives the front shaft. And both the "yellow" gears always rotate in the same direction.

[sim]

I wasn't talking about the torque making the buggy lean. I was thinking about the weight of the motor making the left side heavy. But then, I looked again and it's no more unbalanced than a 511X.

[colmo]

I wasn't talking about the torque making the buggy lean. I was thinking about the weight of the motor making the left side heavy. But then, I looked again and it's no more unbalanced than a 511X.

Motor on one side, servo, ESC and receiver on the other. Presuming 50g, 80g and 20g respectively, that's maybe 40-50g heavier on the motor (190-200g) side. A lightweight motor would even it out a bit.

[sim]

It does look a bit unbalanced on their demo unit, but they were using a club transponder on the motor side. A personal transponder can fit right on top of the servo. The 511 has components in pretty much the same places, so it shouldn't be a worry.

[Origineelreclamebord]

So if the shafts don't run in opposite directions, what's the use of all the extra gears in the centre? It's not a diff, it's not something magical spell or device from Harry Potter to make things fly very controlled and unrealistic while in mid-air, and so far the only things we do know about it is that it adds weight to the car and it's rotational mass, plus the gears make the drivetrain less efficient. Way to go :thumbsup:

[_valtsu_]

Look this picture long enough and you might notice that there is no extra gears. Look where the gaps are.
http://www.jtmodels.co.uk/images/db02_gearbox.png

[Origineelreclamebord]

Look this picture long enough and you might notice that there is no extra gears. Look where the gaps are.
http://www.jtmodels.co.uk/images/db02_gearbox.png

I don't see what you mean. They could have used one bevel gear at the spur and one bevel gear at one single centre shaft if both shafts are to run in the same direction. Splitting the shaft into two pieces and adding two gears makes no sense to me. The reason why they're on the car, the offset of the shafts, could easily have been removed in the design.

It would be more useful carrying around your spares inside the car so you have them with you when needed than using them in the drivetrain and having them wear down while you carry them around in your car :)

[sim]

We already discussed the reason for not going with the single shaft one page earlier. The four gears do look like a lot of extra friction and complexity but it is really just one extra gear contact point compared to the Awesomatix tourer. It's certainly more maintenance than previous designs, but if it works on the track, it will have a following. I'm not so convinced by the sideways stick pack design though. That does seem a step backwards as competitors are getting slimmer and slimmer with great results.

[_valtsu_]

I think with 4 gears gears don't wear so quickly. If this gearbox works properly maybe next TRF car has same kind of layout and gearbox with saddelpack lipos.

[colmo]

To reduce roll in high grip situations, there's always the option of using a shorty lipo across the back, much as you can in a X6.

[Origineelreclamebord]

We already discussed the reason for not going with the single shaft one page earlier. The four gears do look like a lot of extra friction and complexity but it is really just one extra gear contact point compared to the Awesomatix tourer. It's certainly more maintenance than previous designs, but if it works on the track, it will have a following. I'm not so convinced by the sideways stick pack design though. That does seem a step backwards as competitors are getting slimmer and slimmer with great results.

I doubt that with the right gears (right size and shape, good mesh, right alloy steel, machined perhaps instead of cast) you'd need two additional ones. There are many cars that don't need 4 gears for a system like this, right? It's not the 5 grams that bother me, just that in my eyes they did something that wasn't necessary.

And perhaps it's also a bit of disappointment that it's not a 'new' and 'innovative' feature Tamiya designed, but just two gears added to the car... :p

[mof]

And perhaps it's also a bit of disappointment that it's not a 'new' and 'innovative' feature Tamiya designed, but just two gears added to the car... :p

To my knowledge, there are not too many 10th scale off road race cars with this layout and shaft drive...

[sim]

I doubt that with the right gears (right size and shape, good mesh, right alloy steel, machined perhaps instead of cast) you'd need two additional ones. There are many cars that don't need 4 gears for a system like this, right? It's not the 5 grams that bother me, just that in my eyes they did something that wasn't necessary.

And perhaps it's also a bit of disappointment that it's not a 'new' and 'innovative' feature Tamiya designed, but just two gears added to the car... :p

Yes, in an ideal world with no budget constraints, using expensive bearings packed full of balls, with machine cut gearboxes and gears ground from hardened steel, all to extreme tolerances, you could support that layshaft on just one side and run the centre shaft straight through. That is true.

This car has less gears than the DF-03 and although there were many complaints about that car, few if any were related to extra friction or gearbox maintenance. It's just that the early pictures on this one got people all excited about counter rotating shafts, centre diffs and flux capacitors, so when it turns out that they were just gears, feelings were hurt and hearts were broken.

[ericcanton]

Interesting solution, rather like one of the possible ways of building the Awesomatix touring car, and evocative of the classic Tamiya 4wd chassis. Puts the motor in the ideal orientation for getting the power down, but also hangs it out off the side of the chassis:thumbsup:

[rcaddict]

Yes, in an ideal world with no budget constraints, using expensive bearings packed full of balls, with machine cut gearboxes and gears ground from hardened steel, all to extreme tolerances, you could support that layshaft on just one side and run the centre shaft straight through. That is true.

This car has less gears than the DF-03 and although there were many complaints about that car, few if any were related to extra friction or gearbox maintenance. It's just that the early pictures on this one got people all excited about counter rotating shafts, centre diffs and flux capacitors, so when it turns out that they were just gears, feelings were hurt and hearts were broken.

True, maybe a center diff is overkill on a 1/10 scale electric car, but there is no doubt in my mind that the leaning TRF502 of Pisa would have benefited from counter rotating shafts. Man that thing tilts to one side everytime you hit the throttle in mid air. I've seen it with me own two eyes. :thumbdown:
Everybody knows flux capacitors are too big to fit in an R/C car. They havent been able to shrink that technology down to 1/10 size yet. LOL!

[sosidge]

True, maybe a center diff is overkill on a 1/10 scale electric car, but there is no doubt in my mind that the leaning TRF502 of Pisa would have benefited from counter rotating shafts. Man that thing tilts to one side everytime you hit the throttle in mid air. I've seen it with me own two eyes. :thumbdown:
Everybody knows flux capacitors are too big to fit in an R/C car. They havent been able to shrink that technology down to 1/10 size yet. LOL!

The 502 and other shaft cars lean to one side because of the longitudinal motor, not because of the centre driveshafts.

The moment of inertia of the driveshafts is insignificant; they are relatively lightweight; slender; have their acceleration cushioned by a slipper clutch and rotate 4x slower than rotor in the motor.

How many times does the DB-02 design need to be explained before people understand why it is the way it is???

[fastinfastout]

well, I'd rather hear a press release from tamiya about this car, than read BS from wannabe engineers on this forum

[Jamie.T]

well, I'd rather hear a press release from tamiya about this car, than read BS from wannabe engineers on this forum

Some of the guys on this forum are actual engineers and are more than qualified to pass comments on what they see, in fact a lot of discussion of what goes on in threads like these filter back to manufacturers so they can improve in future.

Also when tamiya release the car, they won't go into any great detail like what has been discussed above. So threads like these are really interesting. :)

[DCM]

We can all speculate on wear rates and transmission drag, but in the end until the car is released and being run, we are all just guessing. I will say, it is less complicated than a Schumacher 4wd transmission....

[Chris]

I'm an Engineer ;)


But what should be discussed is: Will this car outperform the DB01?

And i think the answer is the same as the comparison between the the TRF511 and the TRF502X. Both cars performs the same but different. DB02 will be faster in the hands of one driver while the DB01 will be faster in the hands of the other driver.

[DaveG28]

Anyone know when this is likely to be released?

[Spoolio]

well, I'd rather hear a press release from tamiya about this car, than read BS from wannabe engineers on this forum

Are you being ironic?

If we are to take manufacturer marketing speak as sacrosanct why can't I make the A-finals with my box-stock re-re Tamiya Hornet? The box says its a "1/10 scale High-Performance RC Car". It must be because I cannot drive properly I guess. No manufacturer has ever fed the market some BS (especially in a press-release) to stoke up expectations and desire in the wallets of prospective buyers right? Nah, they wouldn't dare, they only ever tell it straight.

As already posted, the proof of the pud will be when the thing is out in the market and being used. Until then its all just speculation anyway.

And there are plenty of "wannabe engineers" on here that may not have a BSc but can give good advice based on experience. I'd rather listen to what someone who has used a product has to say rather than pay any attention to a marketeer/copy writer who probably has no real idea of what he is actually writing about (how many Reliant brand managers actually drove a Rialto for example?).

[rcaddict]

I dont hold a degree in mechanical engineering, but I do hold a patent with the US Patent Office for a high performance motorcycle air intake system that I designed, and I have built a plethora of R/C car, airplane, and helicopter kits.
Does any of this count?? :confused:

[DaveG28]

I do have an bsc in Eng (and business studies, joint degree) and I don't have a f***ing clue!

Does anyone have any idea of a release date then?

[DCM]

Next year, with a month ending in a Y...

[Origineelreclamebord]

Next year, with a month ending in a Y...

Let me guess... It will be July? :D

I may by the way have (another) explanation for the choice of 4 aluminium gears. (Other than Tamiya's fetish for aluminium gears) :p

They could've done it with two steel gears, but this system is likely to be too heavy. If you use aluminium, roughly 3 times as light (and 3 times weaker), you could use 4 gears and still save weight. They may also be not as strong, but most of the difference in strength is covered by using the extra gears. Perhaps the two steel gears give an amount of strength they don't need, so they saw an opportunity to save weight by using two more gears and aluminium instead of steel?

[kentech]

February 18th release in Japan.
Mighte be here a bit earlier.

http://data7.blog.de/media/663/6116663_1095413a9f_o.jpg

[carpaste]

To my surprise, it costs much more than a DB01.
I only care whether the gear box cover of a DB02 fits that of a TRF502X.

[Soo]

Yen is way too strong atm. 40 % stronger than few years ago.
Thats why all the rc products from Japan are so expensive atm.

http://finance.yahoo.com/q/bc?t=5y&s=EURJPY%3DX&l=on&z=l&q=l&c=usdjpy%3Dx

[carpaste]

I mean that a DB02 priced at 32000 yen is much more expensive than a DB01 by about 9000 yen.

[jimmy]

This seems like a very expensive price for quite a low specced car? or is that just me.

I hope the differentials aren't as poorly designed as those on the DB01 :(

[mof]

I hope those are not the same shocks as on the DB01...

[DCM]

http://www.rc-champ.co.jp/net-car/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=30893

[kentech]

http://data7.blog.de/media/112/6147112_dd09b524d9_m.jpg

http://data7.blog.de/media/114/6147114_af997f95b4_m.jpg

http://data7.blog.de/media/111/6147111_3209dd0ed7_m.jpg

[bzb]

plastic fantastic :thumbdown:

[carpaste]

It seems that the A parts of trf502x are the same as that of db02.
Dd02 released is a good news for somebody who runs trf502x that they do not worry that the A parts break and cannot not be gotten

[jimmy]

I wonder how long the gears will last without a slipper?

[carpaste]

it mainly depends on the power of the motor if you do not use the included motor

[colmo]

I wonder how long the gears will last without a slipper?

It's poor that Tamiya still consider a (very expensive) upgrade such as a slipper as an option part - in the age of brushless motors, it's a necessity. Ansmann, LRP, FTX, Caster and others are putting out very good cars now that are both cheaper than this car, and have a slipper as standard.

The version to have of this car will be the DB02-R - they represent a more race-ready chassis.

[DaveG28]

It seems that the A parts of trf502x are the same as that of db02.
Dd02 released is a good news for somebody who runs trf502x that they do not worry that the A parts break and cannot not be gotten

Where did you get that from?

[carpaste]

Where did you get that from?

Only guess by the pictures
I am looking forward to its instruction.

[qatmix]

Here is the official video

Y1Rm4hTwR5o

http://youtu.be/Y1Rm4hTwR5o

[kentech]

Arrived ;)

http://data7.blog.de/media/109/6177109_54d6472642_m.jpg

[colmo]

I note this kit is now available in the UK....for £270, about the same as a B44.1 or DEX410v3 kit. And it's not an 'R' spec kit either.

[rcaddict]

I like the body, but I'll wait for a 'PRO' spec or 'R' spec to be released before I take the plunge. I'm glad I didnt buy a 502. ;)

[muratti]

I like the body too, only problem is that i don´t like the Chassis it is mounted to. :woot:
The price is simply ridiculous, i wonder what a potential "R" version will cost!

[mof]

Arrived ;)

http://data7.blog.de/media/109/6177109_54d6472642_m.jpg

Could you measure how well a short lipo fits under the battery holders? That is, does the connectors end up under the holders, or is a shorty lipo too short? With a shorty lipo the weight would not be located as wide as it is with a normal stick pack lipo.

[Chris]

Where did you get that from?

Item #54345 RC DB02 Carbon Rein A Parts - Gear Case (http://www.tamiyausa.com/product/item.php?product-id=54345)

Compatible with DB02 and TRF502X chassis

[DavidAMS]

So the a parts on the 502x are not reinforced?

[kentech]

So the a parts on the 502x are not reinforced?


Yes, they are. But so far they have only been available as a 7-digit special order part (which means that they were hard to get and expensive). With a normal 5-digt option part number this will change.

Yesterday I added some text to the build pictures:
http://kentech.blogs.se/

[discostu]

Problem still not fixed then

[jimmy]

Just building the centre gearbox on mine - its giving me a headache! haha:lol:

:bored:

[DCM]

I would offer, but I knows you just luuuurv's building Tamiya's!!

[jimmy]

I liked how the e-clips were the wrong colours in the manual so without reading the sizes I broke one trying to install it as it was never going to fit. :(
Got to try find a 2.5mm e-clip in my collection of 'stuff' somewhere, I must have one. Hopefully.

[till]

So all over al the car looks nice!

But I´d like to know if it´s worth it´s money.... is there a big diffrence in the handling of the car?

[MHeadling]

Post up some pics of your finished car Jimmy, or will we see it action at Off Road Wars??

Are you doing one of your epic reviews on the DBO2?? :thumbsup:

[jimmy]

Will bring it to Off Road Wars - not sure if I will have it completed / racing or not, I might have to race it without a painted shell, we'll see. So far it seems quite good, I've messed up the build already which is funny.

So that comment about e-clips above is really my own fault / Tamiya's silly bagging system a bit to blame also. Never mind haha.

[MHeadling]

Lets hope you can get it done, I have a set of TRF dampers you can borrow if that will help?

Look forward to having a look at the car.

[F1END]

+1 for another epic oOple build article. The DB01 review was what made me join oOple in the first place.

[muratti]

+1 for another epic oOple build article. The DB01 review was what made me join oOple in the first place.

+1 for the review, Jimmy it´s been a while since your last one and i love all of them.

[MHeadling]

Hows the build going Jimmy??

Meant to chat to you about it at Maritime but was busy trying to keep my wheels on my 410! lol

[jasonrcb]

Yeah come on jimmy,i used mine on sunday,it does go really well especially as apart from the slipper clutch it was box standard,i did blow out 1 of the plastic centre cup joints,have a set of metal on the way so that will be problem cured.

Loved driving the car even if it takes some getting used to on the eye,but sold my durango as much preferred driving the DB02

[DavidAMS]

jason,

where did you get your db02 from?

[jasonrcb]

Stella Models in hong kong,they also have the slipper clutch and the first of the released spares

[jimmy]

,I raced my review car today - I did 5 laps before the rear drive cup melted and I had to switch to racing 2WD with a DEX210 instead.

Tamiya can't have tested this car at all - I ran it on low grip with a slow motor and drove steady to get used to it, but it still melted itself.

Oh well. What metal outdrives are available for this car, and where can I get them?

[jasonrcb]

I did exactly the same jimmy on mine,judt the rear 1 like you.

I have steel 1s on mine now,not the correct cups there no where to be found,i bought some off blacksmith products on ebay a close fit but there held on by grubscrew,they will do for now.

With them on the car im happy with everything else,the car really does go well

[jimmy]

I would like to know if anyone's managed to drive it without melting it.

Are the outdrives a decent size for the shafts? Do you have a link?

I did a couple of mins practice also before racing and it felt good. I borrowed some trf dampers off my old 501x to try it but never got that far :(

[jasonrcb]

No the outdrives are to big,i had to make up sleeves to get them to fit,waiting on an email to find out when they will be available along with the rest of the bling.

I would imagine jimmy anyone who has put power through the car has done the rear cup,the others were fine no sign of melting at all,found that very strange

[Chris]

pictures of the melted cups?

[jasonrcb]

Here's mine,minus the HL shocks they arrive tomorrow,slipper clutch fitted,cvd's all round,chassis heatsink,uprated centre drive cups.
I know its not a top race car but i like it so thats good enough for me

[carpaste]

Here is the website to get the specification of DB02.

www.tamiya.com/japan/download/rcmanual/58507.pdf (http://www.tamiya.com/japan/download/rcmanual/58507.pdf)

This may help you to consider whether to get a DB02 or not.

[Naushad]

This thread has seem to have gone quiet...I assuming this new Tamiya hasnt quite made the cut. Am I wrong?

I was thinking about it but to bring it up at least to a comp spec you'd have to spend loads more on?

What have others experienced?

[kidcongo]

Hmmm,

Think the emphasis might be on "cheap" in the cheaper alternative thread. Will stick with my 502X for now as it has proven to be a great car. Love it more everytime I drive it, and tough as nails.