Friday's racing and small question up for discussion.

cunawarit · #1 24-02-2014

Just wanted to say that Friday's Clubman racing was amazingly freaking close amongst the tourers. A tonne of fun!

I also wanted to ask something? Anyone up for an all out Clubman outing? By all out I mean any timing, just let's see how fast the old Tamiya plastic pieces can go round the track.

Thoughts? Perhaps two heats? Clubman and Clubman/Outlaw... just as a one off

It is just a little suggestion, that's all. Perhaps when there are enough F1s a couple of the fastly tuned tourers could go on the F1 heat.

Failing approval (given the nature of the class this would be entirely understandable), perhaps we could do a brief TC takeover and run Clubman cars amongst the TCs... It may be conducive to carnage amongst the plastic cars, but might be fun as a one off

Chris56 · #2 24-02-2014

Im up for that - will stick the 8.5 in the TA05 and activate the turbo boost.

Chassis/drive train should take it, until I hit a wall

The Doctor · #3 24-02-2014

I'm really NOT wanting to be the "Fun Police" here, but I've heard you all complaining about not wanting rocket-ship cars in the Clubman class, and we have now therefore agreed a set of rules as a Committee, to govern the speed of the cars in this class. This was specifically to reduce "carnage amongst plastic cars". So now I'm confused why you are now proposing to go back to this.

If you're proposing a rule change, please can we scope this out properly and bring it to the Committee for approval and implementation with the right visibility to all club members?

If we're going to use this class as a fully flexible heat where anything goes (which is what I'm now hearing), why don't we just revert to the previous "Outlaw" rules which enabled people to run whatever they want in this heat?

All of the above is intended to be positive and constructive.

cunawarit · #4 24-02-2014

Fair point, well made. If we want to try running a plastic TC at TC class speeds we need to book in for TC.

Chris56 · #5 24-02-2014

Fair point Paul RE keeping Clubman at modest paced - 13T is plenty fast enough and we don't want it to become outlaw.

But there is nothing stopping us running our over-boosted plastic tubs in TC class? Im quite interested to see how a TA05 performs against Mi5s with similar electrics.

Even if we don't stick to touring rules (is it 10.5 or 13.5?), there may be an option to run in that class but not score points.

cunawarit · #6 24-02-2014

You keep on saying tubs, but some of us run TL01s and M03s which are monocoques not tubs.

Sorry to be picky, but my Tamiya is a square plastic pipe with wheels, not a tub

Chris56 · #7 24-02-2014

Quote:

Originally Posted by cunawarit

You keep on saying tubs, but some of us run TL01s and M03s which are monocoques not tubs.

Sorry to be picky, but my Tamiya is a square plastic pipe with wheels, not a tub

I'll change your name to Paul

New appreviation:
"Plastic tub": Any Tamiya chassis with prefix TL*/M0*/TA0*/TB0*/TT0*, or any other brand that has a main chassis made of plastic and not Carbon Fibre or aluminium

Also, doesn't "monocoque" imply that the chassis and body are as one? I would describe the TL01/M03 as a "ladder" or "girder" chassis.

reg · #8 24-02-2014

If your going to run by the TC rules then not a problem,

If your not then stay in clubman,

You all moaned about our cars being to quick so pot kettle black!

siddus74 · #9 24-02-2014

I've raced my tamiyas in with the tourers playing by there rules loads of times and it's not fun at all ... Mostly due to the lack of courtesy, no driving round you in that class more like through you ... Not every one though

.. The increased carnage is due to too much speed and in some cases lack of ability

Scott

reg · #10 24-02-2014

Quote:

Originally Posted by siddus74

I've raced my tamiyas in with the tourers playing by there rules loads of times and it's not fun at all ... Mostly due to the lack of courtesy, no driving round you in that class more like through you ... Not every one though

.. The increased carnage is due to too much speed and in some cases lack of ability

Scott

It's the same in every class!

Chris56 · #11 24-02-2014

I think Gui's original point of discussion centred around a one-off heat rather than a regular weekly thing. To me the question is whether a separate heat is setup for the night or whether they are just raced with tourers.

Lets face it, these cars aren't going to last anymore than 1 night anyway!

reg · #12 24-02-2014

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris56

I think Gui's original point of discussion centred around a one-off heat rather than a regular weekly thing. To me the question is whether a separate heat is setup for the night or whether they are just raced with tourers.

Lets face it, these cars aren't going to last anymore than 1 night anyway!

Not really the point how long they lastin with the TC heat,
It's the fact you should be in clubman or as you say your own heat,
Unless you run by the TC rules! Why should the TC heat suffer because you have all chosen you want to go fast for a night!

leedolby77 · #13 24-02-2014

Quote:

Originally Posted by siddus74

I've raced my tamiyas in with the tourers playing by there rules loads of times and it's not fun at all ... Mostly due to the lack of courtesy, no driving round you in that class more like through you ... Not every one though

.. The increased carnage is due to too much speed and in some cases lack of ability

Scott

Sounds like Clubman to me.......... ( but of course not all )

shiny · #14 24-02-2014

Quote:

Originally Posted by leedolby77

Sounds like Clubman to me.......... ( but of course not all )

Running cars of vastly differing speeds always causes problems! That's why heat seeding should be done to ability and cars stay with in there class rules and not mixed!
Mixing heats will run the risk of ruining a nights racing for all!

The Doctor · #15 24-02-2014

Blimey Martin, I thought you'd forgotten how to log onto Oople! Anyway, welcome!

Absolutely agree - we have agreed the rules for each class for a reason, so let's race to them. Mixing them up will lead to broken bits and frustration all round. If you want a class with "anything goes" rules then just propose bringing back "Outlaw" which was there exactly for that purpose and generally worked well vs that aim. I thought you all wanted Clubman to be a more controlled (I think on the website it specifically refers to "moderately paced") class?

Typically we're getting 6 heats on a night now (2 or 3 Off Road, 1 or 2 Clubman, 1 Touring, 1 GT12) so running a separate heat will generally not be feasible.

Given that I don't race in Clubman I'm not too fussed what we agree, but I do think we need to be consistent with the rules over the course of an 8-week championship.

leedolby77 · #16 24-02-2014

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Doctor

Blimey Martin, I thought you'd forgotten how to log onto Oople! Anyway, welcome!

Absolutely agree - we have agreed the rules for each class for a reason, so let's race to them. Mixing them up will lead to broken bits and frustration all round. If you want a class with "anything goes" rules then just propose bringing back "Outlaw" which was there exactly for that purpose and generally worked well vs that aim. I thought you all wanted Clubman to be a more controlled (I think on the website it specifically refers to "moderately paced") class?

Typically we're getting 6 heats on a night now (2 or 3 Off Road, 1 or 2 Clubman, 1 Touring, 1 GT12) so running a separate heat will generally not be feasible.

Given that I don't race in Clubman I'm not too fussed what we agree, but I do think we need to be consistent with the rules over the course of an 8-week championship.

Well I have to say Paul I totally agree too. When I started racing in clubman 8 weeks ago I did feel that some other people in the class seemed to object to me and a few others being there with the Tamiya F1 cars. In fact to the point where the rules changed to accommodate. Now the rules are being questioned again?......... Race to the rules stated and have fun, if someone is quicker deal with it?.........

Buggy for me this Friday I think, Clubman seems far to clicky.

Chris56 · #17 24-02-2014

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Doctor

Absolutely agree - we have agreed the rules for each class for a reason, so let's race to them. Mixing them up will lead to broken bits and frustration all round. If you want a class with "anything goes" rules then just propose bringing back "Outlaw" which was there exactly for that purpose and generally worked well vs that aim. I thought you all wanted Clubman to be a more controlled (I think on the website it specifically refers to "moderately paced")

You do speak a lot of sense Porl. Just about every car in Clubman is running to the rules and, as last friday proved, lead to some good racing.

Are all cars in touring running to the rules? I thought that it was rubber tyres and 13.5t?

With regards changing rules, there have been several discussions about this but in practice the only changes actually made have been minor. I can't see the rules changing unless there is an overwhelming demand to do so, which clearly there is not

Clubman clicky Lee? sorry you feel that way as i've always tried to be friendly with everybody on the rostrum. Sure some of use discuss our setups each week but we also make those public so others can follow and keep the racing close. Weren't F1 drivers doing the same a few weeks ago and at least 3 of you were having a cracking race? I got to marshall that race and it was great to watch.

Mark - when have I referred to clubman as my "own heat"?

I think we should accept this thread has run its course and has served its purpose: to assess opinion on allowing faster clubman cars.

cunawarit · #18 24-02-2014

No guys, let's not question whether other classes are running as per rules. If they aren't they should be. This was more about enquiring if people would be up for a one off relaxing of the gentleman's agreement as opposed to going against any rules that are in place. The Clubman rules are plenty flexible, people end up running on blinky or limiting throttle to ensure close racing because they want to, but those aren't the rules.

The limit for Clubman is 10T and there are no timing or boost restrictions as far as I understand, that's moderately quick. But most people run 13.5T with zero timing. They do so because they want to race close to someone else, that's all. All I was asking was if people would be happy to forget about that for one round simply to see the plastic junk boxes go fast.

Anyway, the point of asking was to gauge response and there seems to be considerable resistance to any more speed in Clubman. Which is fine, if a plastic fantastic car driver wants to run with of added timing then TC is the place to do it.

siddus74 · #19 25-02-2014

Competitive drivers where winning is paramount should vacate clubman, clubman is I feel gentlemanly and is about having a close race and feeling the enjoyment of slowly catching and working for that clean overtake... It's the only class where people don't try and cheat as far as I know ...

The majority of clubman drivers don't care about winning its a run for fun no pressure class ...it's not the same in other classes that's why I enjoy the gt12 for the competitive controlled element .... That's the reason there is no cup at the end of the season ..

Leave the clubman class to do what they please and exercise there gentlemanly right choose what to race week on week with the outlined power tyres and class of car ...

If you feel that clubman is clicky vacate, easy ... Just the same as if clubman drivers want to run with fast tourers do so in the controlled rc class as I do and have done ..

The door swings both ways moaners deal with it ...

You'll never please everyone and you should have to try, people should aim to compromise and fit in .... At the end of the day I got board of F1 as I was running kit gearing and the other cars were massively faster ... Where the fun in that ... The difference is that running with the tamiya tub boys is more fun as we agree to run similarly paced cars the F1s didn't seem to play like that.

How any other classes do you see you mate waiting for you to come round after he's over taken you to have another bite on the next apex ... That's fun! Having a ballistic car up you jacksey is not fun.

This is my opinion and I stand by it, don't mean to offend but people want difference things from there night out not all want to sacrifice the experience for winning ...

Don't like it find another class or race both.

Scott

reg · #20 25-02-2014

Chris you read it wrong,you mentioned " have a SEPARATE heat or run with the TC",i was agreeing with you about having your own heat,not that clubman was your heat!

I agree with lee,we joined clubman for a bit of fun,then got poopooed for cheating,not having fun,our cars were to fast and not in keeping with what you all set up clubman to be,only interested in winning,the rules changed! made no difference! its the slowest class,yet its the most door banging class we have because of the skill levels,how many of you smashed into the mini and that blue thing last week!does that make you rude?! did he sit in front of lapping cars because he couldnt be bothered to move,it might be because he thinks "well they are better than me so should drive round me"i dont think its any but didnt stop people getting annoyed,but its just for fun!some thing you accept when you choose to run in it,like getting hit up the arse in TC or rolled over in buggys.

I think Chris will agree,running slick rubber tires on any car in any class is tricky,its hard enough to get the car round never mind avoid a slower car or a sideways car,id be very suprised if you did in fact get more laps with what you have planed than you would running an F1 on foams.
I think in TC one car doesnt run by the rules that comes probably 3 times a year,the class did have problems but its settled down with regards to the rules,if you look at the rules for clubman and TC,i think clubman has more,

TC 13.5,rubber,not GT SHELLS................simple,