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  #361  
Old 11-02-2013
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  #362  
Old 11-02-2013
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Originally Posted by discothesnake View Post
I don't understand this thread. Surely the simple thing to do is trade in in your MRT for a Harry you are sorted. Better that than forking out the full price later in the year?

People who bought MRT PT's went for the cheaper option which is fair enough but now they won't work on the new MYLAPS system. Why should MYLAPS worry about that?

I haven't read every post so sorry if I'm not getting the point but it seems a bit of a nothing thread for people to moan.

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  #363  
Old 11-02-2013
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Originally Posted by danDanEFC View Post
Mark, are you a spokesman for MRT?

Maybe they might have something on their website, I will go and check.

Nothing on the MRT website. I have 2 MRT's and I am unsure what to do.
Nope, but I did something so simple, I called them on a phone and asked them direct.........
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Old 11-02-2013
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Originally Posted by Robby View Post
How come clubs have the decoder, and MRT is acting like they can't get one?
That doesn't make sense.



No, it's not an "instant fix" - but we're not talking inventing the laptop computer or building a rocket to go to the moon either.
What is a bold claim is saying "they area working on a fix currently," if you don't work for MRT and aren't the one working on the fix.



Nobody said anything about "MyMaps worrying about it" - what I'm saying is that MRT should be worrying about it and jumping through hoops to service their customers, that spent their money on MRT's product. And not having something on their website, or even emailing previous customers, is a travesty.

But, frankly, I don't care if somebody has a MyLaps or a MRT transponder - something seems wrong if they bought either model in the last year and find out it's useless and they have to pay to trade-up to a new model. Nobody's coming to defense of the people with relatively new transponders that are being told, "you have to pay to upgrade." Imagine the stink that would be raised if your ESC's software stopped working, and the manufacturer told you that you had to send it in to be traded in and you had to pay for the privilege of being able to run your car let alone race your car.

I actually spoke to MRT.....
You last paragraph makes no sense those with recent my laps don't need to upgrade?..
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  #365  
Old 11-02-2013
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Originally Posted by TARTMAN View Post
Harry is £76....... thats the full retail price.

where did you get £100 from?
Maybe it's my failing memory - but when I bought my PT's they weren't cheap but they nearly doubled in price not long after. I'm sure they were tickling £90 - but maybe that's my failing memory.

PT's are just one of the awesome things I love about racing now. For club racers / new racers / lil Jimmy with his £50 second hand car - it's a real shame that a new modern hand-out that's robust and reliable isn't developed. I'd never have started racing if I had to buy a PT first.
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  #366  
Old 11-02-2013
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jimmy i agree all this could be putting new drivers off racing
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  #367  
Old 11-02-2013
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The major sanctioning bodies, like, IFMAR - should surely know that PT's are both good and bad. Some pressure and petitioning of Mylaps to reintroduce a system of handouts would surely help the hobby world-wide.
Once you're hooked on racing, a PT sells itself because it makes life easier.

oOps - have I just upset everyone with a sensible idea again
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  #368  
Old 11-02-2013
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Originally Posted by sosidge View Post

The BBK offer to trade in MRT's is pretty generous in my opinion, considering they are basically taking a fake product and giving you an authentic one at a heavy discount in return. But that offer stops at the end of March, as does the offer for a cheap upgrade to the RC4 decoder.

That might not be a problem right now - but it will become a growing problem in years to come. AMB/Mylaps won't support RC3, supplies of Hybrid transponders will probably dry out soon, and any club that wants to buy an AMB/Mylaps system (or needs a repair) will end up with RC4 - and straight away you are back to the same issues with MRT transponders.

UK racing has nothing to gain by declining the AMB/Mylaps updates in favour of keeping compatibility with MRTs. What seems a cheap choice now, will be an expensive decision forced up us in a couple of years time. And any suggestion that AMB/Mylaps will have to cave into pressure from a few UK racers and withdraw RC4 or change it to ensure compatibility is a complete flight of fancy - there is a plentiful market for RC4, with or without the UK.

I'm just glad I stuck with an authentic AMB from Day 1. I didn't buy an MRT on principle. My transponder will work with any decoder, and I know that I'm the only person with my number anywhere in the world. Not something every MRT user can say. It's a shame the the existence of the MRTs has put the clubs - the backbone of racing - in such a difficult position.

That's ridiculous!

What you're saying is like suggesting that whomever invented the automobile, that every other manufacturer of automobiles (including all the British car companies) are "fake products."

AMB/MyLaps have repeated tried to increase the cost involved in using their products - from discontinuing "handout-out/club" transponders (with the introduction of the original "personal transponders 6 or 7 years ago, to the introduction of their smaller 2-wire transponders 2 years ago (to compete with the smaller MRTs), and now with their 3-wire transponders (I can't keep up with all the names you guys are assigning to the models - purcy, harry, etc.) and corresponding RC4 decoder intended to kick MRT out of the game entirely.

The reality is, and I don't care how much anybody wants to spin any of this, is that MyLaps is trying to create a monopoly by cornering the market.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmy View Post
Maybe it's my failing memory - but when I bought my PT's they weren't cheap but they nearly doubled in price not long after. I'm sure they were tickling £90 - but maybe that's my failing memory.

PT's are just one of the awesome things I love about racing now. For club racers / new racers / lil Jimmy with his £50 second hand car - it's a real shame that a new modern hand-out that's robust and reliable isn't developed. I'd never have started racing if I had to buy a PT first.
Exactly, when I bought my first PT they cost £40. Pretty soon after that they price starting climbing. And once MyLaps corners the market again, do people really think the price is going to remain stable? No, of course they won't.

And you're correct about the handouts too. It was just last week a newbie father and son showed up at the track, all excited about racing, but at the end of the day he lamented to me about the £180 (he was quite shocked) he was going to have to dish out just so he and his son could race.
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  #369  
Old 11-02-2013
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Originally Posted by Robby View Post
That's ridiculous!

What you're saying is like suggesting that whomever invented the automobile, that every other manufacturer of automobiles (including all the British car companies) are "fake products."

The reality is, and I don't care how much anybody wants to spin any of this, is that MyLaps is trying to create a monopoly by cornering the market.

AMB/MyLaps have repeated tried to increase the cost involved in using their products - from discontinuing "handout-out/club" transponders (with the introduction of the original "personal transponders 6 or 7 years ago, to the introduction of their smaller 2-wire transponders 2 years ago (to compete with the smaller MRTs), and now with their 3-wire transponders (I can't keep up with all the names you guys are assigning to the models - purcy, harry, etc.) and corresponding RC4 decoder intended to kick MRT out of the game entirely.
Erm, your comparing it wrongly.... a car drives on a road, no one company has road building for the globe, so there is a set standard that is generally smooth, has corners and mostly black, so all manufacturers make cars to run on that..... Now, pay attention, MyLaps make a system which they support to accurately record times triggered by bugs. They design a digital bug that goes across it, triggers it correctly and records a Unique ID...... MRT have taken a Red PT, copied 95% of it (maybe more). They have taken MyLaps design to be able to make something to work on a MyLaps system, so in effect, they have copied it. Now, MyLaps have no need/requirement/social responsibility to support MRT. I doubt that MyLaps really see MRT as an issue or problem, simple as that.

I think people got to get it out of their minds that MyLaps are forcing MRT out, conspiracies etc, as really, if you look at it, MRT are the ones that copied MyLaps and are now falling foul of it. Maybe, as well as shouting at MyLaps to reduce their PT costs, we should do the same to MRT to support their product which is now being forced out of market??

But, as I say above, Mylaps is the original, MRT is a very good copy, but that is all it is, a Copy, I am sure if someone started selling a phone that operated on iPhone software without Apples authority, they would be in deep doo doo...
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  #370  
Old 11-02-2013
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Erm, your comparing it wrongly.... a car drives on a road, no one company has road building for the globe, so there is a set standard that is generally smooth, has corners and mostly black, so all manufacturers make cars to run on that..... Now, pay attention, MyLaps make a system which they support to accurately record times triggered by bugs. They design a digital bug that goes across it, triggers it correctly and records a Unique ID...... MRT have taken a Red PT, copied 95% of it (maybe more). They have taken MyLaps design to be able to make something to work on a MyLaps system, so in effect, they have copied it. Now, MyLaps have no need/requirement/social responsibility to support MRT. I doubt that MyLaps really see MRT as an issue or problem, simple as that.

I think people got to get it out of their minds that MyLaps are forcing MRT out, conspiracies etc, as really, if you look at it, MRT are the ones that copied MyLaps and are now falling foul of it. Maybe, as well as shouting at MyLaps to reduce their PT costs, we should do the same to MRT to support their product which is now being forced out of market??

But, as I say above, Mylaps is the original, MRT is a very good copy, but that is all it is, a Copy, I am sure if someone started selling a phone that operated on iPhone software without Apples authority, they would be in deep doo doo...
So, by your way of thinking, since British Petroleum didn't invent gasoline that they shouldn't be allowed to manufacture it either - since all they did was copy Standard Oil in the U.S. -- and you'd be quite happy riding your bicycle to go race your RC cars using your MyLaps PT to score it.

Got It!


I guess at that rate, since we're trying to put down manufacturers for "copying" - then anybody that's not driving an A-arm based suspension car that isn't branded Team Associated, and anybody that's not using an Electronic Speed Control that's branded Novak, is wrong too.
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  #371  
Old 11-02-2013
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Hi All

I've said this before, but i'll say it again - you're thinking as RC Car racers, i.e. you're thinking that what we do is the deciding factor in how MyLaps goes about it's business, we're quite simply not.

The entire timing industry is Personal.

RC Car racing is a small part of the market they supply, we don't determine it, we're just a part of it.


Next bit is there ARE Alternatives.

I've been and visited them too, and it's facinating stuff, transponder is a bit bigger and a bit heavier, but arguably at least as good as MyLaps stuff and certainly the brand is much higher profile - actually has a brand 'Image' etc
But it's not cheaper.

And it's not compatible.


To Illustate:-
What you'll see if you visit MyLaps web site is a list of the sports where their product dominates and yes RC Car racing is listed.

If you go to the comptetion
You'll see a list of the sports where their product dominates and RC Car's isn't listed


The 'competition' in the industry is basically to win an entire sport (or in the case of the BIG ones a definate, clearly defined, part of it) as if you end up with Both timing manufacturers involved in one area then the poor competitor ends up having to carry two transponders all the time..

This is why you're thinking that it's a monopoly, it isn't it's just that MyLaps got RC Car Racing first and has hung onto it..
In a way that's good as the majority of the UK racers who have a PT have an Amb/MyLaps one - and hence arn't even worried about this thread what-so-ever.
Can you imagine what fun it would be if there were actually several different timing systems in use, none of which were compatible with each other..

Be carefull what you wish for..
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  #372  
Old 11-02-2013
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nicely put Jim, the voice of reason . as always
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  #373  
Old 11-02-2013
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Spencer View Post
Can you imagine what fun it would be if there were actually several different timing systems in use, none of which were compatible with each other..

Be carefull what you wish for..
It would be like the personal computer industry, in which compatibility was forced BY THE CONSUMERS - consumers that didn't want to be forced to own but one of three brands, or be limited by one price point.


I know what I wished for - 18 years ago - was that I didn't have to shell out £2,500 for a decent desktop because there was lack of competition in the marketplace. Now I have a laptop that 5-times the power, 10-times the memory, 15-times the software compatibility..... and...... wait for it.......... costs 1/6th as much. Happy Days!
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  #374  
Old 11-02-2013
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Originally Posted by Robby View Post
It would be like the personal computer industry, in which compatibility was forced BY THE CONSUMERS - consumers that didn't want to be forced to own but one of three brands, or be limited by one price point.
Was it heck as like - try 'The Software Manufacturers'..

And that didn't quite work did it - anybody got an Apple Mac?

Oh and I think the scale is about by about a factor of a 100k or so
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  #375  
Old 11-02-2013
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robby View Post
Exactly, when I bought my first PT they cost £40. Pretty soon after that they price starting climbing. And once MyLaps corners the market again, do people really think the price is going to remain stable? No, of course they won't.

And you're correct about the handouts too. It was just last week a newbie father and son showed up at the track, all excited about racing, but at the end of the day he lamented to me about the £180 (he was quite shocked) he was going to have to dish out just so he and his son could race.
Don't mean to offend anyone - it's just my assumption that they'll raise to record prices sooner or later. I don't think AMB won't bow to pressure - but it's not for racers to apply that pressure, it's surely the governing bodies to suggest these things.
Surely they have some influence? What good is it for the sport to not have hand-out transponders. It's technically possible and would help the sport - and in turn also sell more PT's when people become hooked.

Or they can just go dick about in a carpark like probably 95% of R/C cars sold in the country. This statistic is entirely fabricated - but you see the point.

There's plenty of people interested in R/C cars who've never really been interested in racing because it looks too serious - and I'm sure buying a bit of timing equipment isn't really gonna help matters. My mate came to a club race - he only came once since he didn't really enjoy it much (it was a TC race, btw) which is fair enough - but he'd not even have been able to go if he had to have a PT.

What I'm getting at is handouts - bring them back!
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  #376  
Old 11-02-2013
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Rob, when your car breaks down, the local garage can plug it into an OBDII reader, and obtain a generic code or you can take it to a main dealer and have it plugged into their reader and have a full diagnostic.... which costs more.

You keep comparing Generics and specifics.
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  #377  
Old 11-02-2013
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Rob, when your car breaks down, the local garage can plug it into an OBDII reader, and obtain a generic code or you can take it to a main dealer and have it plugged into their reader and have a full diagnostic.... which costs more.

You keep comparing Generics and specifics.
Like I said - "I guess at that rate, since we're trying to put down manufacturers for "copying" - then anybody that's not driving an A-arm based suspension car that isn't branded Team Associated, and anybody that's not using an Electronic Speed Control that's branded Novak, is wrong too."


I suppose part of the thing that gets under my skin is that - during this period from when we all went from using handout PTs to shelling out the bucks to buy our own PTs, and then the forced upgrading of the decoders - is that we're paying for something that hasn't really changed or been improved from the barebones basic model I first saw at the track 25 (what?) years ago.
We've got these little bingers in our cars that count our laps and give vaguely accurate lap times.
If these systems were designed in a way, such as they are have been in 1:1 racing where the times and other prevalent information was transmitted to my pits (laptop) - or god forbid, my smartphone - then I might be impressed. But, to be honest, I haven't really seen any vast improvement to justify the cost and changes involved, other than one that suggest a monopolistic intent........In My Humble Opinion.
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  #378  
Old 11-02-2013
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Originally Posted by jimmy View Post
Don't mean to offend anyone - it's just my assumption that they'll raise to record prices sooner or later. I don't think AMB won't bow to pressure - but it's not for racers to apply that pressure, it's surely the governing bodies to suggest these things.
Surely they have some influence? What good is it for the sport to not have hand-out transponders. It's technically possible and would help the sport - and in turn also sell more PT's when people become hooked.

Or they can just go dick about in a carpark like probably 95% of R/C cars sold in the country. This statistic is entirely fabricated - but you see the point.

There's plenty of people interested in R/C cars who've never really been interested in racing because it looks too serious - and I'm sure buying a bit of timing equipment isn't really gonna help matters. My mate came to a club race - he only came once since he didn't really enjoy it much (it was a TC race, btw) which is fair enough - but he'd not even have been able to go if he had to have a PT.

What I'm getting at is handouts - bring them back!

handout transponders its the way forward!!.

have to agree with jimmy, we need to be able to time the new guy without expecting him/her to lash out on a PT which they may or may not get any benifit from if they decide RC isnt for them, some clubs do carry PT's for this use, but get very nervous about them going missing, a simple battery operated version of the PT would fit the bill.
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  #379  
Old 11-02-2013
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handout transponders its the way forward!!.

have to agree with jimmy, we need to be able to time the new guy without expecting him/her to lash out on a PT which they may or may not get any benifit from if they decide RC isnt for them, some clubs do carry PT's for this use, but get very nervous about them going missing, a simple battery operated version of the PT would fit the bill.
couldn't agree more, I'm always banging on and on about handouts, I run a small friendly club in norfolk, we have plenty of young families really enjoying the hobby, but on a really tight budget, I don't use AMB, but I wish I could, but if I was how could I ask a dad with 3 sons who want to race to pay out £200+ on a little red box's so they can race at club.+BRCA membership+club membership + race fees.

I'm with Jimmy, In this economic environment do we think AMB are going to do anything but find as many ways as possible to extract more money from as many racers RC or other as possible?
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  #380  
Old 11-02-2013
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As an aside -how about a thread here on facebook to add your voice to the call for Mylaps to put out a new handout for clubs to use. Surely if they see people care it might help - maybe not, who knows.
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