TRF-511 -The end of the road?

james54321 · #1 28-07-2011

i am a happy 511 owner however after the recent IFMAR championships, i cannot help but think Tamiya are going to push for the 502x development.. I am not just talking about where Lee came (which i think was very respectable), it was more to do with the overwhelming majority of shaft driven cars in the top tiers. Even in Europe the Team Associated b44.1 (which lets be honest has a fair few similarities with the 502x) takes up a large chunk of the final groups.. This is not a debate of shaft vs belt but just wondering that if the 502x could be developed just like the 501x was (and here is another one would you prefer to drive a 501 or a 502x?), Tamiya could have another great car on their hands just like the 511 is/was. Maybe Lee could answer this one but from a business model point of view Tamiya surely need to develop the 502x and have their top drivers racing it considering they don't even produce (or if they do in small numbers) the 511 anymore..

apologies if this seems a bit of a rant but just wanted to share my thoughts and see what everyone else thinks..

mattybucks · #2 28-07-2011

I think it's the 502 that at the end of the road. People on here have been trying to sell them for weeks.

511's are still in great demand with people still paying top money for the awesome kit. I also think that Tamiya/Lee are developing a few new parts for the 511 (I'm sure Lee will confirm).

The 511 is already the UK National Champion (2 years running now) Current European Championship winning car (also at Finland).

Don't forget the new double WC was at the top of his game. That does not mean that the B44.1 is the better car, just the driver was on form and the conditions were more suited to that car.

Unless Tamiya bring out a new 4wd car, or Lee moves to a different team then I can't see him using any other car for the forseeable future.

Jamie.T · #3 28-07-2011

I certainly think it would be great if Tamiya developed the 502 and brought it along like the belt driven cars were. The 502 is a very capable car with some minor adjustments, however i think the 511 will take some beating, especially on tracks here in the UK and parts of Europe.

Each car suits a surface type better than another, and it was clear to see at the Worlds that the shaft driven cars got it done, but that's not to say they were better cars as Lee was right up there amongst them with the belt driven 511.

I would certainly like to see Lee running the 502 and comparing his times with the 511 on some of the tracks hes visited, that is the only way to really see the difference. Ive run my 502 and 511 back to back and found the 511 faster, but with time and development the 502 could be as fast. Lets see what happens in the future....

dbizzle5 · #4 28-07-2011

If Lee starts using the 502x again then they would all of a sudden be the car to have again and the band wagon would be a rollin....

West Ridge Racing · #5 28-07-2011

Well, in My opinion the 511 is all time best car I have driven and talking results from the wc Dustin evans did a great job with that old xxx4. I hope that Tamiya see this trend from over here in Europe and keep the 511 alive. I have heard that the 502 was made to compete against kyoshos and yokomos in Japan where they have à huge market. The 511 was not as popular there as it is here. If they start copying Fredriks diff covers they would easily sell a lot more of 511s. I for one.

Alfie · #6 28-07-2011

Quote:

Originally Posted by thomj316

I certainly think it would be great if Tamiya developed the 502 and brought it along like the belt driven cars were. The 502 is a very capable car with some minor adjustments, however i think the 511 will take some beating, especially on tracks here in the UK and parts of Europe.

Each car suits a surface type better than another, and it was clear to see at the Worlds that the shaft driven cars got it done, but that's not to say they were better cars as Lee was right up there amongst them with the belt driven 511.

I would certainly like to see Lee running the 502 and comparing his times with the 511 on some of the tracks hes visited, that is the only way to really see the difference. Ive run my 502 and 511 back to back and found the 511 faster, but with time and development the 502 could be as fast. Lets see what happens in the future....

Watch this space

dobber · #7 28-07-2011

I run the 502X and its a fantastic car. I'd love for it to be developed more with a few more hop ups and support. It works extreamly well on the grasstrack i race at.

DaveG28 · #8 28-07-2011

Unfortunately I am not as convinced that that the 502 just needs ambit of fettling to be as good as a 511, although it can be close!

The issue is I think a fair amount of parts need remoulding, and that's not cheap! It really needs the front tower to match the kickup angle, and personally I think part of what makes the 511 so good is that the steering is also angled with the front suspension. To do that on the 502 needs new chassis/gearbox case moulds. Plus the the camber links need redesigning (although there is a workaround for this!)....a lot of work!

Finally, strength, I didn't do a single bulkhead or front tower at the worlds, I genuinely believe I would have done 3-5 front gearbox cases with the 502...@£100!!

Still, I do think the 502 can do plenty quick laps!!

Plus, as someone said, if Lee used the 502 and won Southport we'd probably see everyone trying to buy one!!! I may still get another too as I like the new bling!!

chrispattinson · #9 28-07-2011

From speedtech models:

Hi Chris,
The ETA on 511 kits is late August. That's the word from Tamiya America.

Thanks for inquiring,

Jeff Yung
Speedtech R/C

KyleHirano · #10 28-07-2011

I think the 511 and the 502, are both capable of winning the worlds, and are top notch buggies. I just think AE has top drivers, and they spend a lot of money on a race team. AE spends more money advertising and putting together a dream team of racers. AE kits lack quality because of it.

Belts rule, shafts suck

Just my opinion.

Welshy40 · #11 28-07-2011

If I was from TRF I would question why the guys are still running the older models instead of using the newer kits. My guess is the shaft drive isnt a quality product as Lee would be running it.

Maybe they should keep developing the 511 as there are items on the car that were badly designed in the first place like the stupid slop on the hubs (this makes a huge difference on handling), badly positioned spur gear so not easy when it strips, cheap quality bearings and by redesigning and upgrading them they may actually get a worlds win.

fastinfastout · #12 28-07-2011

Quote:

Originally Posted by Welshy40

If I was from TRF I would question why the guys are still running the older models instead of using the newer kits. My guess is the shaft drive isnt a quality product as Lee would be running it.

Maybe they should keep developing the 511 as there are items on the car that were badly designed in the first place like the stupid slop on the hubs (this makes a huge difference on handling), badly positioned spur gear so not easy when it strips, cheap quality bearings and by redesigning and upgrading them they may actually get a worlds win.

would gluing the bearings on the hub be a quick fix? What I did was score the inside of the hub with a knife.

I noticed this on my db01r, but not so on my 511, not as much anyway!

KyleHirano · #13 28-07-2011

I'm running a DB01r and there is a lot of slop in the hubs. Bearings just fall out of them even when new?

TRF201 aluminum rear hubs are a great improvement over the plastic ones.

Does someone make a geared diff for the 511 or DB01r?

GRIFF55 · #14 28-07-2011

I have to agree with Amish (daveg28) , the 502 can do amazingly fast laps but just not as consistent as are possible with the 511. Thus making the 511 way easier to drive for mere mortals like us.
Also got to say, if something was released with all the sexy 502 new bling, i'd be tempted too.

The 511 is a VERY VERY good car, it has got itself on quite a high platform to be beaten...

DCM · #15 28-07-2011

Dunno if it is the different material used in the TRF/DB01R, but on the stock DB01 items, the only play I get, is from the bearings when they wear.

Fredrik Emilsson · #16 28-07-2011

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaveG28

The issue is I think a fair amount of parts need remoulding, and that's not cheap! It really needs the front tower to match the kickup angle

Don´t think the angle of the tower is that important. I agree that the bulkhead/shock mount is a bit too far back though.

I would´nt worry about future cars, bet Tamiya listens to the factory drivers...

DaveG28 · #17 28-07-2011

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fredrik Emilsson

Don´t think the angle of the tower is that important. I agree that the bulkhead/shock mount is a bit too far back though.

I would´nt worry about future cars, bet Tamiya listens to the factory drivers...

I know the angle in itself is technically not important, the issue is even when you spacer the tower forward the angle difference makes it very difficult no to bind the top of the shocks, there is still no forward/backward movement. If you spac it forward to give he movement, the shock is again at. Different angle to the arm....mayb it's nothing, but I like loose shocks!

Welshy40 · #18 29-07-2011

Quote:

Originally Posted by fastinfastout

would gluing the bearings on the hub be a quick fix? What I did was score the inside of the hub with a knife.

I noticed this on my db01r, but not so on my 511, not as much anyway!

Why, I mean why should you as you have already paid a much higher price for this car and it should have been designed properly before selling it. Tamiya has always been over priced so youd expect them to do it correctly before selling it. I would buy it again but only if it has decent bearings, zero slop, a slipper clutch and spur that are on one side of the car (similar design to the YZ10) so maintenance can be done easily and messing pinion/spur will be easier as well.

ottoswe · #19 29-07-2011

Regarding Lee and the 511 at worlds, he won the practise a final and the car looked awesome, but Lee was 'alone' with his car and setup. Marc and Viktor is great talents but i think in a worlds you would perfer the offroad knowledge from lets say the ae team with 10 top level electric offroad drivers.

Belt is the way to go and Lee did an amazing job!

mattybucks · #20 29-07-2011

Quote:

Originally Posted by Welshy40

Why, I mean why should you as you have already paid a much higher price for this car and it should have been designed properly before selling it. Tamiya has always been over priced so youd expect them to do it correctly before selling it. I would buy it again but only if it has decent bearings, zero slop, a slipper clutch and spur that are on one side of the car (similar design to the YZ10) so maintenance can be done easily and messing pinion/spur will be easier as well.

The car is easy to work on, maintenance is a dream compared to other cars I've had. 4 screws to get the diffs out, true the slipper shaft is probably the hardest part of the car to remove but it still easy to do. I've not mover the motor or changed the spur for about 6 months.