Toro 160 Amp dead

[Ross]

I purchased a used Toro 160amp ESC and LRP 6.5 around 4-6 weeks ago. I put the ESC and Motor in to a car i'm building at the moment, its the first time ive used these items.

So after binding the ESC to my RX I tried it, the motor has a pinion on but the spur isn't connected to the rear of the car due to the belt tensioner needs fitting. I revved it a few times, all was ok, I worked a bit more on the car,(end points for the steering) and tried the motor again. This time it revved and stopped suddenly with a spark coming from the motor. I disconnected the battery and tried to move the spur/motor, it was very tight. I removed the motor from the car and took it apart, its not good, ie in bits.

This morning I put the setup box on the ESC, all settings had the * next to them apart from the ones below. After setting it all back to standard I tired 2 different motors, these don't work although the PT,RX and servo work fine.

:Turbo 60 Degree
:instant turbo
:Turbo engage slop 30 degree/0.15
:motor timing = 00 degree Push to start
: poles 2
:Punch 48%
:turbo engage slope 45 degree/0.15
:turbo deactivate slope 28 degree/0.15
:wheel diameter 60mm I think it had.


so would these setting affect it, would it cause an issue, it did spin proper quick but there wasn't a load on it so it may just of seamed quick.

I'm not fussed about the motor, the ESC not working is a pain, could it be repaired may be. Have the setting above with that motor combo caused the issue or could of been an issue with either if the products ive purchased?

Cheers
Ross

[Adam F]

Might be worth checking with Colin, I know he had some problem with the 160..

Also heard of some software thing that can occur by using the old firmware..??

[neallewis]

60deg turbo is excessive, certainly on a 6.5. might be fine for a stock motor, 13.5, 17.5, etc. you should have done a full default before use.

With no load on the high revving motor, looks like you have spun it up past the point of destruction.
I don't think you can blame the previous owner of the speedo here.

[SlowOne]

Agree with Neil, you have destroyed the motor and probably the speedo with it. Total timing using the speedo should NEVER be over 60 degrees, and that's assuming the motor is on zero degrees. Boosted motors must NEVER be on full throttle without a load.

When using speedo timing the motor MUST be set to zero degrees for the 60 degree rule to apply. If you have timing on the motor, deduct that from 60 degrees - 20 degrees on the motor means no more than 40 degrees from the speedo.

Why is it necessary to use any speedo timing in an open-motor class? If you want more speed then isn't the answer is to motor up? I can understand a bit of turbo for the straight (with DCM's caveat that this makes flying more difficult) but I don't understand why one would want to corrupt the throttle feel so badly with a lower-powered motor boosted up. Just my 2p...

[Ross]

I didn't think the timing was right for a 6.5, and the fact it spun so quickly.

I'm not blaming anyone, just asking the question if it was the settings or poss another issue. As you say Neal, I should of done a full reset, my bad.



So, could the speedo be fixed maybe ?

Originally Posted by neallewis

60deg turbo is excessive, certainly on a 6.5. might be fine for a stock motor, 13.5, 17.5, etc. you should have done a full default before use.

With no load on the high revving motor, looks like you have spun it up past the point of destruction.
I don't think you can blame the previous owner of the speedo here.

Originally Posted by SlowOne

Agree with Neil, you have destroyed the motor and probably the speedo with it. Total timing using the speedo should NEVER be over 60 degrees, and that's assuming the motor is on zero degrees. Boosted motors must NEVER be on full throttle without a load.

When using speedo timing the motor MUST be set to zero degrees for the 60 degree rule to apply. If you have timing on the motor, deduct that from 60 degrees - 20 degrees on the motor means no more than 40 degrees from the speedo.

Why is it necessary to use any speedo timing in an open-motor class? If you want more speed then isn't the answer is to motor up? I can understand a bit of turbo for the straight (with DCM's caveat that this makes flying more difficult) but I don't understand why one would want to corrupt the throttle feel so badly with a lower-powered motor boosted up. Just my 2p...

[neallewis]

Originally Posted by Ross

I didn't think the timing was right for a 6.5, and the fact it spun so quickly.

I'm not blaming anyone, just asking questions if it was the settings or poss another issue. As you say Neal, I should of done a full reset, my bad.



So, could the speedo be fixed maybe ?

Sure, just trying to salvage whats left. What does it do now? can you solder up another motor, power up on battery, reset turbo timing to 0, or default with progbox?
Does it recalibrate? and spin up as expected
you may have taken a phase out when motor gave up?

[Northy]

Try another motor, see if it spins up slowly. If it doesn't on it's own, but does if you start to spin it over by hand then one of the phases of fets is dead Might be able to fix it.

G

[Ross]

Yeah, if I don't have to buy a new ESC then that will help the pocket .

Sorry, forgot to mention I have tried 2 other motors this morning, they didn't work using the transmitter, I didn't try spinning over by hand, I'll give it ago later.

One thing it did do, when I turned it back on after it happened the negative power cable jumped, yes jumped, it stayed on for a few seconds then turned off. I turned it back on and held the button for 5-10 seconds, resetting it I suppose, the PT,RX and servo all work fine, it just doesn't run the motor.

Originally Posted by neallewis

Sure, just trying to salvage whats left. What does it do now? can you solder up another motor, power up on battery, reset turbo timing to 0, or default with progbox?
Does it recalibrate? and spin up as expected
you may have taken a phase out when motor gave up?

Originally Posted by Northy

Try another motor, see if it spins up slowly. If it doesn't on it's own, but does if you start to spin it over by hand then one of the phases of fets is dead Might be able to fix it.

G

[mattr]

It's probably worth noting for future reference that brushless motors spin up really fast with no load........ Really, really, fast. Like zero to destruction in a second or possibly even less. Even without going to full throttle. (60 degrees of timing will have helped!)

[Ross]

Originally Posted by mattr

It's probably worth noting for future reference that brushless motors spin up really fast with no load........ Really, really, fast. Like zero to destruction in a second or possibly even less. Even without going to full throttle. (60 degrees of timing will have helped!)

That's defiantly what's happened 😟. You live and learn, next time I'll reset everything 😊.

[dazp83]

I've spun up my 1/8 motors and 1/10 motors and been fine. I've also had three sky rc escs give up the ghost, recently one lasted few rounds and lost power and now won't work at all.

[mattr]

Originally Posted by dazp83

I've spun up my 1/8 motors and 1/10 motors and been fine.

it's very dependant on the motor and how it's made, some can be ok, some can pop almost at random, even the same motor from different batches. It's really not worth testing though, gets expensive in motors.

Originally Posted by dazp83

I've also had three sky rc escs give up the ghost, recently one lasted few rounds and lost power and now won't work at all.

That's just bad luck, or something about your settings/use profile combined with a weakness in the design. Three failing for one user, just due to a manufacturing fault is extremely unlikely. We'd more likely see hundreds failing. i.e. an entire batch.

[zoaman]

well i also have a toro 160 and find that the fan on the esc does not last longer than a few heats.some others in the club have the same fault too. fitted a new one direct to the rx in the end.so what is up there? is there another problem with them?

[dazp83]

The first one got a bit of water in and stopped working, left it for a month and then worked fine for months and then stopped one day. So partly my fault, the other two have been the 150amp 1/8 escs and they both done the same, wouldn't work with sensor lead then stopped completely. One not old and one on first run. Also have a friend who had the same issue.
I have the 120amp alloy cased one in my 1/10 now and it's great, much better with hard case.

[Ross]

I spoke to Schumacher today. I told the truth and told no lies lol about what happened, unfortunately it doesn't sound like it can be repaired but they will have a look for me, if they can't fix it they will sent back to SkyRC to see what they can do

Anyway I e just ordered a new 120amp from FWM so all is good