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Old 16-07-2013
JonnyC JonnyC is offline
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Morning All

I came down on Sunday to watch, and the impressive track and organisation has reaffirmed my desire to get back involved in racing after a 20 odd year absence. (I was a former member of BMSBC).

I have a newish car (purchased a few months ago CatSX3) and still have my old Tamiya car from the early 90s, but I am struggling to adapt to the new technology, and understand how best to tune it

Who would be the best person to speak to with regards to joining, and would anyone be willing to offer some tips and advice to help me get re-educated?

Many Thanks

Jon
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  #2  
Old 16-07-2013
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Hi mate
Si Coe is our re-education coordinator pm him I'm sure he will advise on electrics. My one bit of advice on electrics is buy cheap buy twice!

Buy expensive as its better and if you don't like the hobby it'll be worth something when you sell it unlike cheap gear that will just give you grief from the start and worth nowt if you decide to sell



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  #3  
Old 16-07-2013
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Chris Elworthy Chris Elworthy is offline
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I'd have to agree with Bud's here, I started up racing again last summer and went down the cheap route with components, I have since replaced absolutely everything apart from my batteries.

Things have changed a hell of a lot since the days you used to race where I imagine you were using mild modified brushed motors, early ESC's and Sanyo SCR batteries. These days we all run brushless motors and speed controllers which as the name suggests do not use brushes touching a commutator to create power it is all created through the magnetic field within the motor can...please do not ask me to elaborate further on the mechanics as that's about as much as I know and all you need to know really. These motors have absolutely no touching parts so there is no wear at all, install it in your car and forget about it, I'm running the same motor since last summer and have no intention of changing it. Different motors do off slightly different characteristics and feel so that is generally the only reason people will ever change them they won't wear out.
In order to operate the brushless motors we also now use specific speed controllers designed for these motors. Most of these offer fully programmable software so you can fine tune your power to suit track conditions easily trackside...sort of like an ECU or something an F1 team uses in the pits to make the engine smoother or more aggressive for example.

The other major change since your days of racing is the use of lithium polymer (LiPo) batteries, similar to the ones that power your laptop. This for me is the biggest advance as unlike the Nicad packs we used to run where we had to carefully gear our car to last the 5 minutes without dumping and you would need to discharge the batteries before charging to keep them in top condition this is no longer an issue. Lipo batteries can be continuously topped up with charge with no damage caused to the battery and here's the best bit....you get up to 20 minutes duration from one fully charged pack!! This means you can get away with using just one (as I do) pack all day and just too up with a bit of charge between runs, many use the same pack for 3runs without any recharging and have no problems.


My advice is nip into JE Models in Pilsworth and speak to Stu or Nick, they will give you all the info you will need and if you ever need help trackside were a friendly bunch who always have time to help.


Chris
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Old 16-07-2013
Gavin Collingwood Gavin Collingwood is offline
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God where do you start??...... Yeah what Chris said....
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Old 16-07-2013
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I don't know your budget but this is everything you'll ever need no matter what your driving skill level

Here's the link

http://www.jemodels.com/electric-mod...tegory_id=1276
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  #6  
Old 16-07-2013
JonnyC JonnyC is offline
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Thanks for all your replies, greatly appreciated, and especially to Chris for the detailed explanation. My old SC wasnt even electronic, and I even remember discharching the old batteries after every race with a car bulb, Im liking the new LiPo batteries, but i didnt know they could be part charged, so thanks again for the info.

Maybe I wasnt very clear in my first post, with the advice from a model shop, i have my car running with all the gear in it as follows:

Cat SX3 CF
Etronix Photon 2.0 SBS 9.0R Motor/60A ESC
Spektrum DX4S 4 Chl. DSMR Transmitter w/SR410 Receiver
Thunder Power Lipo 5000mAh 2S saddle x 2
Savox Steering Servo

I suppose my question should have been, is the above gear any good and suitable for racing, or do I need to look at changing it, and also how should the car be setup for the Bury track? eg Suspension, Tyres etc

I was also wondering what would be a good spares package to take to a race (Im sure Im going to break something)

What makes/types of cars do most people race at Bury?

And finally, who should I be speaking to about joining the club?

Sorry for all the questions, but your help is greatly appreciated

Jon
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Old 16-07-2013
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Reventons have a rep for bugs though. Most SP users run the older GT's.


As Chris said, in the electric world its true we've really never had it so good. Unlike the old days, at last weekends regional the cars in the lowest final were just as quick as the cars in the top final - there are no more 'team spec' cells or motors.

I'm not totally convinced that its all buy cheap buy twice. ESC's I would certainly agree, but other stuff not so much. I've got £25 Turnigy NanoTech cells that are just as capable as my much more expensive Orions, and I've seen a few people with Turnigy Trakstar motors that look decent enough.
Radio wise I've been burnt with cheap ones that don't work and won't give up my KO in a hurry but I also see plenty of happy Flysky owners. Even with servos I've bust a few cheap ones but also got some still going strong that perform as well as my much more expensive Ace 1015.

Its just about knowing what you are getting and more importantly what you can do if it doesn't work.
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Old 16-07-2013
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OK, well you'll find the esc/motor a little underpowered in a 4wd. The 9.0R is a weird motor that is actually a 380 size core in a finned can to bulk it out to 540 sized. This means it revs really high, but generates very little torque. Its a great bashing motor in a 2wd, but not what you want for 4wd racing. Its also sensorless and you'll find almost all racers use sensored systems. They offer a lot more control especially at low speed.

Tyres = Schumacher yellow minispikes in the dry, most favor Ballistic buggy greens in the wet. However grip is so high right now I prefer Schumacher green minispikes which offer a little less grip in the dry but work a bit better when its damp (as opposed to WET) than yellows.

Not sure anyone currently runs an SX3. A few members got one, but then decided they didn't want a 4wd. We do have a Schumacher team driver (Stu) but he runs a K1 and never had an SX3.

I'm the guy you'll probably speak to about joining, because I'm the one you'll find in the race control cabin swearing at the computer. I'll just hand you a form and pass it to Neil who is our club secretary though....

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonnyC View Post
Thanks for all your replies, greatly appreciated, and especially to Chris for the detailed explanation. My old SC wasnt even electronic, and I even remember discharching the old batteries after every race with a car bulb, Im liking the new LiPo batteries, but i didnt know they could be part charged, so thanks again for the info.

Maybe I wasnt very clear in my first post, with the advice from a model shop, i have my car running with all the gear in it as follows:

Cat SX3 CF
Etronix Photon 2.0 SBS 9.0R Motor/60A ESC
Spektrum DX4S 4 Chl. DSMR Transmitter w/SR410 Receiver
Thunder Power Lipo 5000mAh 2S saddle x 2
Savox Steering Servo

I suppose my question should have been, is the above gear any good and suitable for racing, or do I need to look at changing it, and also how should the car be setup for the Bury track? eg Suspension, Tyres etc

I was also wondering what would be a good spares package to take to a race (Im sure Im going to break something)

What makes/types of cars do most people race at Bury?

And finally, who should I be speaking to about joining the club?

Sorry for all the questions, but your help is greatly appreciated

Jon
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  #9  
Old 16-07-2013
Gavin Collingwood Gavin Collingwood is offline
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If money isn't that much of a problem, get the Orion R10 speed control it's awesome. Reliable and the customer service is 2nd to none
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  #10  
Old 16-07-2013
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Totally agree with what the guys are saying

I've been racing now for about 7 months with the club and love it and I've gone through so much changes. Car, electrics, ect

I have the same sensor less system you had but when you change to a sensorsed system, you'll never look back.

With what si was saying regarding the turnigy batteries and the trackstar motors, these are really good and cheap but good quality.

I used a turnigy trackstar 6.5 weekend just got and it could keep up with the fastestest cars, and for £25 delivered from uk, in my opinion you can't go wrong. A few guys run these

The batteries are turnigy nanotechs and like si said, do the job the same as the more expensive sets

If your on a budget, I'd say these are good (others may disagree lol)

Motor http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...arehouse_.html

Batteries
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...strSearch=4850

Hope this helps

Chris
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Old 16-07-2013
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These ESC's are pretty good too and a fraction of the price of one of the big names:

https://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/...dProduct=28377

And you can get about six of them for the price of an R10.
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Old 16-07-2013
Chris B Chris B is offline
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One thing I would add is don't overlook second hand stuff. You can get perfectly decent stuff from eBay at a fraction of the new price.
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  #13  
Old 16-07-2013
Gavin Collingwood Gavin Collingwood is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Howler View Post
These ESC's are pretty good too and a fraction of the price of one of the big names:

https://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/...dProduct=28377

And you can get about six of them for the price of an R10.
But will probably let you down and will be slow and have zero sell on value. Steve where have you been stranger?
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  #14  
Old 16-07-2013
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Nah, they're hobbywings, pretty well established as reliable. I'll be properly back soon hopefully. I've been lurking on here throughout.
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  #15  
Old 16-07-2013
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The x car escs are great value for money, there a near copy of a speed passion gt esc and can run hobbyking and speed passion firmware on it too.

I had one and thought it was faulty so sold it...but I was my receiver
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  #16  
Old 16-07-2013
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If they work those are good esc's, being as said basically Speed Passions.
The problem is that sometimes they don't work, and if that happens good luck getting support or a replacement......
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  #17  
Old 17-07-2013
Gavin Collingwood Gavin Collingwood is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Si Coe View Post
If they work those are good esc's, being as said basically Speed Passions.
The problem is that sometimes they don't work, and if that happens good luck getting support or a replacement......
Exactly. That's why Orion are superb
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  #18  
Old 18-07-2013
JonnyC JonnyC is offline
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Thanks to you all for your kind help and advice..

After also speaking to a very helpful chap on the phone from JEModels, and taking your advice into account, he also advised the Orion R10 along with a HPI Flux Pro 7.5T Motor, so these have been delivered today...so hopefully i can get it all set up and ready for the weekend.

Was hoping to come down again on Sunday, meet some of you, and get signed up, is there racing happening this weekend?

Thanks

Jon
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  #19  
Old 18-07-2013
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orion and Sp are both made and manufactured buy hobby wing open them up and read whats on the chips inside
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Old 18-07-2013
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SP GTs are hobbywing but Reventons aren't. And have a poor rep as a result
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