Yank Needs Carpet Help

[MOmo]

Greetings all.

A yank from across the pond turning to the experts for setup advice.

Our indoor off-road track is closing and relocating to a larger building. We are also making the jump to indoor carpet from high traction clay.

I have questions for you carpet aficionados out there.

-is there significant differences in different types of carpet?

-They ordered and installed the OZITE Carpet offered from CRC, does anyone else race on carpet like this?

-2wd buggy (running centro 4.2 in 17.5, B4.2 Mod and B44.1 4WD)
Please to be educating me on tires or is that dependent on Q1?
*Seems like they are looking at PROLINE Tires as the Go-To tire choice.
(I see that people favor the Schumie mini pins and fronts, but for us accessibility could be a challenge)

-Any tips or tricks to racing on carpet or changing ones style to work on carpet?

-To those who have raced both dirt and carpet, are there huge significant differences?

-Saddle vs shorty? 4.2rm vs centro 4.2 on carpet. Shock setup for carpet vs dirt? Both cars are on BB.

-I see some folks modify the front tire to run Inside the inner bead, vs flush with the face of the rim, what does this do?

-Sorry for all the questions.. Its a new ballgame running on Carpet, vs packed Clay.

Thanks in advance


Momo (Yank)

[andy110m]

Hi,

Our local club races on carpet, I think its called primatrack GT but I could be wrong.

We don't have many jumps so its mainly flat track. Our set up is limit the shocks to get it slammed to the deck, make it nice an stiff and bang some foams tyres on it. Sort of turn them into touring buggies which might not appeal to everyone but hell they're fast.

I believe its what you chaps across the pond would call "a sweet ride"

Joking aside, I'd start with foams tyres, CRC might be able to give advice on the compounds to start and which additive works best. Then tune the suspension to suit your track.

Best of luck.

[Karting]

tyres wise

Schumacher yellow mini pins all round on 4wd

Schumacher yellow mini pins on rear and Schumacher low profile cut staggers infront for 2wd

(I believe jconcepts or proline are now selling there own version of our mini pins, which might make it easier for youto get hold of?)

Having never raced on clay I can't tell you setup difference. But that is tyres which are used over here on carpet

A lot of people are now using shorties instead of saddle packs now.

Also tere are now a few 'carpet/high grip' specials released over here which are near impossible (unless yor a top drier, which I'm not!) to beat. search 'x-factory x6 cubed shaft' 'team c Tm2' and 'kyosho Db2' basically they are 4wd middle an rear of car with a 2wd front end bolted on.

[Pacman]

You can find specific set-up info at the following pages:

http://www.petitrc.com/setup/associa...entroC4.2.html
http://www.petitrc.com/setup/associa...dRC10B4.2.html
http://www.petitrc.com/setup/associa...RC10B44.1.html

Generally speaking, I would use Schumacher tires as per Karting's advice.

At some tracks, the club prefer you not to use spiked tyres as it rips up the carpet. In these circumstances foams are the best to use.

The only feedback I've seen on the Proline tyres is that they wear quicker then the Schumacher tyres.

The cut staggers tyres on the 2wd fronts are quite narrow. That tends to be why people will put the inner bead not flush with the inside of the wheel. I also don't put inserts in my cut staggers. I did have a pair where I had inserts and put the inner bead flush with the inner rim of the wheel. It resulted in the car having far too much initial bite on turn on fast corners resulting in the car rolling and crashing!

I also run shorty packs and put them as far forward as possible. My car is an Ansmann X2C (aka TeamC TC02C). Basically over hear, the higher the grip the more forward you need the weight distribution.

[andrewc]

Re the rim/tyre question, basically a schumacher front tyre is designed for a narrower 2WD specific rim, whereas most front tyres for dirt are a wide front width, same rim size for 2wd/4wd.

Most people take a knife to the rim and cut off the inner edge flush with the interior bear mount wall; you then mount the outside edge of tyre as usual, and the inside edge just butts up against what was the inner bead mount. Some people don't cut the rims down, so they can use again for full width front tyres, rather than just the schumacher narrow front, hence the strange pics you've seen!

We race carpet with jumps; have a look at 1066 Racing on Facebook, couple of videos. As you're racing centro I'm assuming you were high bite, in which case I'd be really interested to know how similar the set ups will be, might well work as is.

I run a B5M, pretty much standard kit set up but with stiffer springs, AE blue all round. Also 4mm front axle postion instead of 2 as in kit. Next time out am going to try anti roll bar (sway bar) with softer springs. Though obviously set up is very personal to driving style!

Defo yellow mini pins and cut stagger low profile all the way here; rears are good for one meeting, then only really practice. Fronts last for several but you'll notice a huge difference very time you put new ones on. HTH

[neallewis]

Schumacher slim mini pins on 2wd fronts fit fine on regular sized rims. no rim cutting needed. The slightly wider tyre is less aggressive and preferable to cut staggers on most carpet or indoor tracks. i like to take the outer one or two rows of spikes off as these can have a big effect on grip roll. we tend to run mixed carpet on low traction gym/sports hall floors. setup changes are generally lower ride height, heavier oils and a little stiffer springs. Schumacher yellow minipins are better than the prolines for sure.

[MOmo]

I appreciate the feedback.

-I tore into my Centro and installed the GearDiff. (Does anyone use one in their car, or are you all favoring the BallDiff?)

-I printed out a couple different carpet setups,
I went with a combo of these :
http://www.petitrc.com/setup/associa...nse2014011112/

http://www.petitrc.com/setup/associa..._MRTO20131201/

I plan to try different fronts, with and w/o foams, my question is- I presume the kit foam that comes with the tire vs the closed cell foam is what I would want?

Is anyone still running a Centro, or have people graduated to the 5m?

What is the best way to "cut down" the front wedges?

Is it favorable to run Cut down tires with or w/o foam
Obviously lots of options:
-Stock tire - no foam
-Stock tire - Cut Foam
-Cut tires - No Foam
-Cut tires - cut foam

I'd like to have some with and w/o foam. *If cutting the tires down is helpful, I will.
*Does anyone have pics of their Carpet Centro 4.2 to share?


-Thanks for all the help so far. HOPEFULLY in the next week or so I will get some track time.


MOmo

[Richard Lowe]

I still run the C4.2 indoors when we have a mix of carpet and wood/rubber/cork floor, on a 100% carpet track these days though you have to run one of the forward motor 'cheat' cars to be really competitive.

As far as the Jesper C4.2 setup you've posted above goes - the only thing I'd change would be the rear inner camberlink height, from my experience I always run it on the second highest hole when running indoors. The Centro naturally has a really locked in rear end and raising that ballstud frees it up a bit, which is always faster on the clock. Other than that I run the shocks a little different, AE Blue front and Green rear springs and middle hole on the rear tower.

For tyres, Schumacher yellow minipins on the rear and 4wd front in every situation, the Proline tyres come close but just aren't Schuey pins... On 2wd front I always try to run the 2wd yellow minipins if I can, it's only on the front motor car on very high grip I move to the slim stagger ribs with no insert.

Speaking of inserts, don't entertain the idea of using closed cell or US open cell/stock inserts as they are way too firm/high profile. Go for something like these, specifically the blue ones as the firmer HD ones are more intended for minispikes.

Gear or ball diff... depends on how much grip there is and how loose you want the back to be. In general the back moves around more with the gear diff in, but when there's enough grip you get more forward drive than you would with the ball diff. This is a case of trying both and see which you prefer

[MOmo]

Just about ready.

still need to glue tires. I think this first go around I'll run no foam in the front.


hope to test this next week.



Momo

[Burty248]

You never run foam in the fronts as there slim line and sit on the wheel snugly, there is no space for foams!

If you go for the most average set-up with the centro you cannot go wrong, one good thing about running on carpet is its a lot easier to set the ride hight correctly as there are no odd bumps in the track.

You may want to also look into a brass bulkhead as it is the most used hop up for the centro.

[MOmo]

So i took it out a couple weeks ago and ran it.

-1st qual went pretty well
-Opted for Losi Yellow Rear, and Losi Blue front
-I've been using saddle packs, placed fwd
-car worked good, a little bouncy in the rear.

2nd qual
-Adjusted the springs- AE Yellow R
-Also adjusted the spring adjustment-
-car seemed to wash out more, gobs of steering
-

-Main
-borrowed tires- mine seemed to have not held up when I glued them.
-Still washing out, went back to the setup from my first qual, other than AE springs


How can I stop the washing out? How mch EPA are people using? (I use a Fut. 4PK)
How about braking? (I'm using a HW V2 on Blinky)

Someone at the track suggested standing the shocks up. (I think its in the middle hole)

How important is adding weight to the front of the chassis? Also, (Pretty sure my chassis might have a slight tweak, how much will that affect the car?

Still getting used to this MM thing and finding a proper setup. I'll re-read the setup sheets from Petit. (curious if there is a "Baseline" setup?)

I'll continue to work on my setup. Would it be favorable to switch to shorty instead of saddle?


Thanks!


MOmo

[MOmo]

Raced friday and made some changes.

-Lowered the R ballstud on the tower
-switched hub to the fwd position
-over concerns for the pins tearing up the carpet, we're switching to worn Gold barcodes all around, with sauce on the rear.

First heat went well, adjusted to the car and tried to stay consistent. Finished 3rd

2nd heat, was doing better even led for a bit. Had my pinion gear move on the motor, end up further back, 4 or 5.


Main- started 3rd on the grid. Got kinda punted by another driver fought back up. Opted for a different pinion, geared 31 75, shoulda tried 23. Finished 4th only only 2 nites of full racing. Vety happy with this car coming along.


Momo