Tamiya Durga DB01 EP Buggy (A cheaper 501X?)

[Carno]

Originally Posted by carnage

I don't like twitchy oversteering cars, this setup is perfect for me but might not be for you
However everyone who's seen the stock db01r setup says it's tooo soft
STeve

The 'R is indeed a bit soft. But for our track not by much.

I'm still running my own DB-01 on the Tamiya oil that came with the Aeration dampers which is more or less 32.5 WT Losi.
For my personal feel a tad thin for the front and a bit to stiff for the back.

Front
Atomic shocktower
32.5-ish oil (to be 35)
Yellow springs
Blue stabilizer

Rear
Atomic shocktower
32.5-ish oil (to be 30)
Yellow springs
No stabilizer

That reminds me. If I push the front my dampers bottom out before the car hits the ground. Anyone else with AC shocktower in front have this or do all db-01's have this. (I kinda forgot if it did with the stockshocktower.)

[Migs]

Originally Posted by DCM

smaller pistons up front is the way to go, and keep the same oil.

Yeah agreed, though if u find the car is over-damped, u can use a thinner oil to compensate, the smaller holes will create more "pack" so the shock will initially resist the landing better but it in normal conditions the car should react similar to before

[simoncrabb]

Originally Posted by Carno

That reminds me. If I push the front my dampers bottom out before the car hits the ground. Anyone else with AC shocktower in front have this or do all db-01's have this. (I kinda forgot if it did with the stockshocktower.)

Mine does this bottoming out thing at the front with an AC shocktower.

I don't know if it does it with the stock one, I suspect it does? I'm sure the AC front is the same as stock.

[i4n]

Originally Posted by Carno

That reminds me. If I push the front my dampers bottom out before the car hits the ground. Anyone else with AC shocktower in front have this or do all db-01's have this. (I kinda forgot if it did with the stockshocktower.)

I've got a DB-01 front tower and the TRF shocks and my chassis hits the surface before the shocks fully compress. But only just (there's about 1mm of travel left in them).

[dimblum]

Thanks everyone for your great feedback

I'm going to try your recommendations to change my pistons and possibly my springs as well. I already bought the Associated front spring pack so I can run some tests.

I also noticed the same problem where the front shocks will bottom out before the chassis hits the ground. This seems to be the case when the standard mounting hole positions are used (which is what I prefer). Laying the shocks down a little more seems to let the chassis touch the ground before full compression, but then the chassis sits a little too low and the steering is affected..

Looks like I might be experimenting to fix both problems.

[fastinfastout]

Yes it seems to be a problem with the db01. At first I thought it was just me but everyone else seemed quite content with it.

I even unscrewed the shock bottom a few turns, however it was not enough.

It seems tamiya didnt design this cars shocks too well, but even the trf shocks from what I heard have the same problem.

need just a little longer front shocks.

[Carno]

Originally Posted by dimblum

Looks like I might be experimenting to fix both problems.

Let us know what your findings are!


My own car is finally running again. The new thrust bearing fixed my diff/plate slip problems completely.
Such a joy to drive with proper diffs

Now all that's left is to do the shocks properly and do some testing before sundays clubrace.

[jkyamog]

Originally Posted by i4n

I've got a DB-01 front tower and the TRF shocks and my chassis hits the surface before the shocks fully compress. But only just (there's about 1mm of travel left in them).

Same here. Stock front tower and TRF dampers, kit position holes I have about 1mm on my shocks when chassis hit the ground. So I think its only the AC front tower that suffers the problem of shock bottoming out first.

I do think there is hardly a difference as I am pretty sure its very hard to land both front wheel at the same time, chassis bottom out and surface is flat. A pebble and slight difference of angle on landing will remove this 1mm clearance difference of a stock and AC front tower.

[dimblum]

Originally Posted by Carno

Let us know what your findings are!


My own car is finally running again. The new thrust bearing fixed my diff/plate slip problems completely.
Such a joy to drive with proper diffs

Now all that's left is to do the shocks properly and do some testing before sundays clubrace.

I'll be racing this weekend as well, so I will report back with the results and what I changed..

As far as the bottoming out problem goes - I kinda wish there was a front skid or something I could install to work around it. Maybe I will get another idea..

[TonyV2382]

Ive been using the AE shocks and they work very well. Running the silvers up front and the greens in the rear. Havent done extensive testing but I think the handling it more forgiving from what Ive observed. BTW whats up dimblum its malice from RCU. I mentioned to you to use those springs, they actually feel like they hold the db01 up way better than the stock white tamiya springs. I ran my 501x the other day with the tamiya springs and although it performed right I kept losing my front end. I just dont think those tam. springs are up to the job of landing big jumps and holding a line when youre gunning it or in the twisty stuff. I feel like Im sliding around way too much with them on and have to contsantly feather the throttle, which is not in my driving nature lol. Im going to give Jimmys setup with the AE springs a go and see what transpires because so far Ive noticed better results, although not conclusive, with the AE's vs the Tamiya whites.

[Carno]

Originally Posted by dimblum

I'll be racing this weekend as well, so I will report back with the results and what I changed..

As far as the bottoming out problem goes - I kinda wish there was a front skid or something I could install to work around it. Maybe I will get another idea..

I got the new oil in. Front feels a lot better. Also a lot of oil was gone. That's why i was having a lot of trouble with my body slapping.

Drilled out the hole for bleeding and filled it that way. * see on the pic i forgot to re-adjust one of my dampers *

My mate with the 'R was here yesterday for a diff rebuild and checked his front with normal shocktower. Doesn't have the bottoming out issue.

Looked at the AC tower again but it looks as if it's mounted to high even, if you look at the space in between.

[TonyV2382]

Let me add something to this issue of the AC towers. I have them as well and there is another problem that may be a factor with bottoming out. When attaching the TRF shocks, the top part (shock cap) sits way back as compared to the location of the lower part on the arm. If you hold the buggy up in the air or on a car stand and compress the shock it wont allow the shock to full extend the arm back to the fully bottom positions which in turn leaves a huge amount of unused travel and hence impact absorption from jumps.

So...to remedy the "stiction"" problem with the suspension I scrapped the plastic upper shock mounts and went for the ball studs that allow a screw to be threaded through them. The aluminum ball end allows for more free movement when the shocks compress and decompress to allow for maximum travel. Also, you must add a few spacers between the tower and the shock cap so that the shock sits more inline with the lower arm, otherwise, as stated before, the top will sit too far back and not allow the shock to fully decompress which leaves the front arm at 50% travel. What I did was use 2 steering bridge bearings, but any spacer will do, I dont remember the exact size, and put them between the tower and the shock cap. then screw it from the back as usual. Im not sure if I used more spacers, but I made sure that the shock sits in line with the lower arm so that it allows for free movement during compression and decompression.

To test this, just keep adding small spacers until the arm is allowed to move freely upwards and downwards without binding. Now this issue, as far as I know, only arises with the AC towers. Im not too sure about the stock towers as Ive never used them being that my DB01 is heavily modified, like Dimblums. Í will post pics soon.

[Carno]

@TonyV

The carbon ones aren't as thick as the plastic shocktowers so it's only logical you'd need to use spacers.
Not that I thought of that myself when I ordered them.
I got the advise on here when I ordered the shocktowers, so I got myself a nice set of tamiya blue spacers, some longer screws and blue 3mm locknuts....



Thinking of modifying the chassis to take the engine plate for some extra cooling. Not really sure if it'll justify the work tho.
Probably more efficient to just drill some holes in the body.

[carnage]

I've got the db01r and it's not as simple as cutting a hole in the chassis
there are mounting lugs recessed into the chassis so the plate sits flush
New chassis is pretty cheap, that's the way I'd go

[TonyV2382]

[QUOTE=Carno;372079]@TonyV

The carbon ones aren't as thick as the plastic shocktowers so it's only logical you'd need to use spacers.
Not that I thought of that myself when I ordered them.
I got the advise on here when I ordered the shocktowers, so I got myself a nice set of tamiya blue spacers, some longer screws and blue 3mm locknuts....

I was addressing the bottoming out issue to people who might not know of this issue. I never had bottoming out problems so I think the only reason it can be happening is due to the low stance at the front if the arms arent allowed to fully extend and I learned this the hard way. Couple of front arms later...lol.

I do recommend everyone try the AE spring sets though. Way more options as far as spring rates and better to fine tune the car . The tamiya whites are just too soft. Even the hards are too soft for the db01. Im running the 1.2's up front w/35w Losi oil and when I put the tamiya blues it still felt a bit mushy. The rear feels way better for some reason even with the soft springs.

[peetbee]

Originally Posted by carnage

I've got the db01r and it's not as simple as cutting a hole in the chassis
there are mounting lugs recessed into the chassis so the plate sits flush
New chassis is pretty cheap, that's the way I'd go

I justified the change to a DB01R chassis as mine had been dremelled by the previous owner and had scratches!

Trouble is it looks too pretty now and I don't want to scratch it
There isn't an easy way to protect these chassis from scratches that won't look horrible is there?

[Carno]

Originally Posted by carnage

I've got the db01r and it's not as simple as cutting a hole in the chassis
there are mounting lugs recessed into the chassis so the plate sits flush
New chassis is pretty cheap, that's the way I'd go

I know it isn't going to be as easy as simply cutting out a hole. But that only makes it more fun to do.
First drill the holes for the screws as those are already marked, then I can screw the plate to the bottom and copy the outline. Cut out what needs to be open. Then sanding(or dremeling) it down until the plate lies flush.

But if the plate is more bling then actual cooling I might just wait till I break this chassis somehow.

@TonyV.

You aren't having the bottoming out issue with the Atomic Carbon front shocktower?

How are your dampers mounted?


@peetbee

You could always drive it like a sissy.

[fastinfastout]

just building a db01r now, and noticed the steering is not slop free. There is just abit of play, maybe too much, and yes its built correctly.

What are you guys doing for a fix?

any good aftermarket items that are better than kit?

[fastinfastout]

does anyone bother greasing the cvd's in off road?

I never usually do, as it just attracts dirt > wear, unless you maintain them like crazy.

Whats your call on this, and if you do, is AW grease the best?

or I was thinking maybe some dry film lubricant

[dimblum]

Hey Malice.. Good to see you one Oople..

I guess this message is for everyone.. I finally got to try my changes to the front suspension today.. Here were my results:

1. Could not find my spare pistons, so I had to leave the stock ones in place

2. Changed the front shock springs from Tamiya Yellow to AE Blue and it felt pretty good to me. You were right Malice, the AE springs seem to hold the DB-01 a little better in the front. Just so you know, the Tamiya Yellow springs have a lb/in rate of 3.58 where the AE Blue springs have a lb/in rate of 4.20. The stiffer springs feel more natural for the front weight of the car. The AE Blue springs add a bit more than the Tamiya Blue springs which have a lb/in rate of 3.80.

3. I solved the bottoming out problem with the AC Tower by moving my bottom shock mount to the far left and right holes instead of the stock center hole. It allowed the chassis to 'just touch' ground right before the shocks ran out of travel - maybe 1mm as mentioned earlier.. Laying down the shocks a little still felt good on the track, so I don't have any complaints.

4. I first ran the front shocks with 35W oil and it felt good. I later switched to 37 1/2W oil and it felt about the same. I think I will try the 37 1/2W oil a little longer to decide.

5. I reinstalled my thicker stock DB-01 front arms for a little more resistance to breakage. They held up well, but I noticed that the thicker arms put pressure on the spring retainers for the Aerated shocks. I experimented with a fix by adding some small spacers to the bottom shock mounts and used longer screws to mount them.. It's a little risky I know, but it seemed to work just fine and it solved the binding problem.. I may go back to the high traction arms to see if they hold up better now that my shocks have more resistance to impact.

6. For added insurance, I changed the rear springs from Tamiya Red to Tamiya Yellow since the track ran out of the Rear AE Spring Set.

The track I raced on was indoor clay - smooth with a good grip. I used J-Concept Bar Code Tires (front and rear) Gold Compound for indoor. They worked awesome on that track and had amazing grip..

I also got to try the Pro-Line Calibur Tires last week on a loose dirt outdoor track.. Again, they were the perfect tire for loose outdoor dirt..

I plan to keep running tests, but was very happy with the changes so far. It definitely solved some of the bottoming out problems after landing larger jumps. My friend said it felt more stiff than he was used to, but could not deny that it had good traction and controlled really well.

Oh, one last thing.. I did notice that the stock front tower does have it's upper shock mount holes in a slightly higher position than the AC Tower. This would explain the problems with the front AC Tower.. If the AC Tower was modified then it would be much easier to solve the bottoming out issue.

Again. Thank you everyone for your help... The suspension is definitely improving..

[QUOTE=TonyV2382;372315]

Originally Posted by Carno

@TonyV

The carbon ones aren't as thick as the plastic shocktowers so it's only logical you'd need to use spacers.
Not that I thought of that myself when I ordered them.
I got the advise on here when I ordered the shocktowers, so I got myself a nice set of tamiya blue spacers, some longer screws and blue 3mm locknuts....

I was addressing the bottoming out issue to people who might not know of this issue. I never had bottoming out problems so I think the only reason it can be happening is due to the low stance at the front if the arms arent allowed to fully extend and I learned this the hard way. Couple of front arms later...lol.

I do recommend everyone try the AE spring sets though. Way more options as far as spring rates and better to fine tune the car . The tamiya whites are just too soft. Even the hards are too soft for the db01. Im running the 1.2's up front w/35w Losi oil and when I put the tamiya blues it still felt a bit mushy. The rear feels way better for some reason even with the soft springs.