B4.1 wheelbase?

[ejw]

Anyone tell me in general terms what handling affect long, short and medium wheel base set ups would give, I assume they will affect the steering a fair bit but not sure how?

Any help appreciated!

[RudolfXC]

A longer wheelbase car rides bumps better but gives less steering.

A shrter wheelbase car is more pointy and edgy over bumps.

[Toyman]

I actually think it's just the opposite: longer base gives more steering. It confirmed by number of trusted sources and by my personal experience, but I might be wrong...

[Tomboo_91]

RudolfXC is right. But when driving a rear motor car like the B4 you will get the motor closer to the rear axles when using a longer wheelbase what moves the weight slightly to the front.

[kayce]

Originally Posted by Toyman

I actually think it's just the opposite: longer base gives more steering. It confirmed by number of trusted sources and by my personal experience, but I might be wrong...

SO you're saying a stretch limo has a tighter turning radius than a mini cooper...rrrrrr-i-g-h-t





But it does explain the ongoing issues with the Russian car industry.

[Toyman]

That's exactly what I thought initially, but it's not that simple.
Couple of quotes:
Charlie Perez' Setup Hints

If you want increased steering exiting the corner with this setup you have a couple of adjustment options.
you can move the rear hubs towards the rear of the car. The further you move your rear hubs back will give you more overall steering and less overall rear traction.

X6 manual
Moving the hub carrier forward increases rear traction in two ways: Primarily you are
adding more ‘angle’ to the driveshaft, so there’s more scrub between the dog bone and
the outdrive as well as in the CVD joint. All this friction locks in the rear end and creates
traction. Moving the hub carrier forward also increases the percentage of weight on the
rear tires, further increasing bite.
Moving the hub carriers back is probably the easiest way to add steering and corner
speed to the X – 6 Squared. It’s one of the most commonly used adjustments for UK
Champion Ellis Stafford. Moving the hub carrier or arm back some will increase
steering throughout the corner. It also makes the car more stable in bumps, and
because the driveshaft isn’t as bound up, the car will “pop” better over jumps.

[Toyman]

Originally Posted by kayce

But it does explain the ongoing issues with the Russian car industry.

it's a hit below belt :-))))

[kayce]

Originally Posted by Toyman

That's exactly what I thought initially, but it's not that simple.

Well, it is - being as what you're noting is changing the mechanical grip and axle angle dynamics via torquing the CVD/driveshaft.
Otherwise, conceptually, it's a pretty simple concept if one gives it any thought.

[Toyman]

Hmmm.. I guess the topicstarter was more interested in what longer wheelbase will give him in b4, not in full-size limo :-) and in b4 longer wheelbase means MORE steering, no matter what turning radius full size Minis, limos or even Ladas have

[kayce]

Originally Posted by Toyman

Hmmm.. I guess the topicstarter was more interested in what longer wheelbase will give him in b4, not in full-size limo :-) and in b4 longer wheelbase means MORE steering, no matter what turning radius full size Minis, limos or even Ladas have

Just from a point of chassis dynamics, the math just doesn't work. If the turning radius is greater there is no way it can have more steering.
Whether the car is more stable, because of a longer wheelbase, and as a result said extra steering input don't upset the car as easily is another matter entirely.

But you are right - great automobiles and feats of engineering those Lada's and Yugo's are.

[Toyman]

your obsession with soviet block cars really worries me, dude. Is it linked back to your university times when you had to drive one of those and that stopped you from getting laid?

[kayce]

Originally Posted by Toyman

your obsession with soviet block cars really worries me, dude. Is it linked back to your university times when you had to drive one of those and that stopped you from getting laid?

No, it was from constantly passing the POS's parked along the side of the motorway....
.... while on my way to university to learn the concepts of basic geometry relative to the radius of circles.

[Toyman]

Obviously, you didn't drive fast enough to be in time for reading class. Just re-read what was the original question.

[kayce]

Originally Posted by Toyman

Obviously, you didn't drive fast enough to be in time for reading class. Just re-read what was the original question.

I read the original question, and passed reading, though your own reading comprehension is being repeatedly brought into question.


I've belabored this long enough, I'll leave it up to all the Russian experts that work in the design department at AE.
(pssst, communism didn't prove to work either)

[Toyman]

So, show us your reading and comprehension skills + some setup ones although I doubt you have any: what wheelbase will give more steering for B4? And put geometry aside for while

Ps something is wrong with your wall calendar. It's 2011 now, not 1991

[kayce]

Go to > http://www.geometry101.com/
Then inquire relative to the known formula > turning circle radius = (track/2) + (wheelbase/sin(average steer angle))

Let me know if you have any trouble with the tough bits, otherwise you should be able to get all your answers there.

[Toyman]

You are making progress, my friend. No reference to communism or Russian cars! Wow!! it's the first step to full recovery and happy life.
What about answering the question about wheelbase and steering?

[gordy]

toyman don't bother. kayce seems to abuse people on every thread he goes on hes a idiot and there's no reasoning with a idiot the mods really should ban him

[kayce]

Originally Posted by gordy

toyman don't bother. kayce seems to abuse people on every thread he goes on hes a idiot and there's no reasoning with a idiot the mods really should ban him

Well done gordy. I haven't abused anybody, sans an idiot here or there. Good to see you joined the club.
(being as you're the one saying an ansmann is superior to a world championship winning b4.1)

Originally Posted by Toyman

You are making progress, my friend. No reference to communism or Russian cars! Wow!! it's the first step to full recovery and happy life.
What about answering the question about wheelbase and steering?

Asked and answered. Though apparently you're still needing work on your reading comprehension.

I'm out, argue with yourself - you appear quite good at that.

[gordy]

Go back and read my reply again - I haven't said that atall.
Which reinforces what I said you're an idiot!